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Rank: S-Class Racing License
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#76 Posted : Saturday, October 3, 2015 12:56:10 AM(UTC)
Originally Posted by: HSV4ME Go to Quoted Post
I am a little disappointed no notice was given for EOL for the FM4 car packs (or FM3). I have filled the garage many times and I have all but 2 achievos to go (1 on FM3). But I like buying and selling cars and always had the intention of buying the car packs but there was always another new game I wanted to get or another DLC and T10 never has Marketplace specials. We all know AH takes up too much time.

Funky Dunk was succinct in his post, there is very little communication on some negative aspects for a technological company. This is even more disappointing.

Happy we get the Community Team with sessions on Twitch, news articles each week and we got more in the lead up to FM6 to get us Racers interested. We also get a very generous rewards program as well as some seasonal or special gift cars and VIP's get gift cars. These focussed details makes us invest more time in their game and makes us happy as we get something for a little time invested here on the website. I will still play Forza as I am starting on FM6, with some of it's bugs.

I don't just play Forza, I like other types of games.

Could T10 do better at communication? Yes. Here is an example.

I'm enjoying playing Bungie's game Destiny at the moment. Yes it is a grind to have 3 characters to level up to 40 and play the quests again and play the new DLC for Year 2 and what am I going to do with all the weapons. I get emails from Bungie, encouraging me to get into the game, go to the questionable vendor with goodies, good communication with stories and details and a website that has a lot of details to read. They even have a topic on "HOT FIXES", items they have fixed in game that was causing issues or undue unfairness. Sure it is across 4 platforms and backing of a big publisher but at least they are communicating and LISTENING.

It would not be fair to compare but we all learn to improve what we do. Start now to improve the future.

This is my opinion and I could be wrong.


Cheers HSV, nice post from you too.

Disappointingly they had an opportunity to answer the tokens question in the WIR and completely failed to do so - can't say I am surprised (and personally hate the tokens, but see how and why they existed).
Rank: Driver's Permit
#77 Posted : Saturday, October 3, 2015 6:23:04 AM(UTC)
Hello, I am a newbie to the Forza world, just started playing three weeks ago. I got to the point where I wanted to buy some car tokens and found out I couldn't. Checked out this discussion and realized I'm going to be very limited on what I can accomplished in Forza 4. So my question is for you experienced users is, what would you recommend to a new user? I do not own an xbox one, although I am considering getting one. Do I give up on the earlier releases and jump to Forza 6? Thank for any advice you can provide.

BassPianoMan
Work Hard, Play even Harder and Always Respect the Groove!
BassPianoMan
Rank: Driver's Permit
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#78 Posted : Saturday, October 3, 2015 1:03:21 PM(UTC)
This makes sense, but is also a missed ooportunity by T10 to cash in on backwards compatibility. I'm sure they'd reap some profits on FM4 DLC the first week that XBone users get to play FM4 on the new console.

That is just my businessman side speaking.
Rank: D-Class Racing License
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#79 Posted : Sunday, October 4, 2015 5:48:43 AM(UTC)
So you've decided to 'EOL' FM4 just one month before backwards compatibility is available on the Xbox One? Derrrrh!
Rank: Driver's Permit
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#80 Posted : Sunday, October 4, 2015 5:24:16 PM(UTC)
i bought the season pass,but never had time to dl the cars due to having to take someone to hospital. next day, i go online and everything is takendown , and i cant download anything. Is there anything Turn 10 is doing for me? nO. Im just avoiding future forza games forever, and i feel horrible playing this one, cause its incomplete with out the DLC
Rank: A-Class Racing License
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#81 Posted : Sunday, October 4, 2015 10:21:41 PM(UTC)
Originally Posted by: Lord Brewster Go to Quoted Post
So you've decided to 'EOL' FM4 just one month before backwards compatibility is available on the Xbox One? Derrrrh!


It's not a decision, it's a licensing issue. If you ask to include a certain car in your game you are given a timed license, once that runs out you can either stop selling that stuff or renegotiate. Sales probably didn't cover the cost of a renewed license so they ended it. I don't understand why they took down avatar stuff as well. Those were just Turn 10 branded, so no license issue there.
Rank: S-Class Racing License
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#82 Posted : Monday, October 5, 2015 12:45:59 AM(UTC)
Originally Posted by: BassPianoMan Go to Quoted Post
Hello, I am a newbie to the Forza world, just started playing three weeks ago. I got to the point where I wanted to buy some car tokens and found out I couldn't. Checked out this discussion and realized I'm going to be very limited on what I can accomplished in Forza 4. So my question is for you experienced users is, what would you recommend to a new user? I do not own an xbox one, although I am considering getting one. Do I give up on the earlier releases and jump to Forza 6? Thank for any advice you can provide.

BassPianoMan


You can still do most things and it is a great game - you just can't get any DLC and will miss any achievements attached to them (like for the Porsche DLC). Same goes for FM3 and FM2.
Rank: Driver's Permit
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#83 Posted : Monday, October 5, 2015 1:29:55 AM(UTC)
Like you guys, I am deeply disappointed by Turn 10 and its communication.
Asking the right questions, it isn’t the end of the DLC that is charged but that Turn10 didn’t warn us that we approached the EOL.

Why Turn10 didn't warn us that the EOL approached for Forza 4?
Why Turn10 also removed the avatars and others contents?
Why is Turn10 did a promotion on the season pass just before the EOL and players who haven’t yet had time to download the packs of cars associated with the season pass are left with a season pass that is useless?

Turn10 may say what it wants, on this one it committed a big mistake.
I don’t buy more products Turn10 either if Turn10 does nothing for us.
You will notice that it has been over a week since the tragedy happened and no relevant communication was made. I don’t see why we would effortlessly player in compensation.
No change of Turn10, I agree with many players and it will be finished with Turn10.
Rank: Racing Permit
#84 Posted : Monday, October 5, 2015 5:14:26 AM(UTC)
Forza release dates on Wikipedia indicate EOL is reached a few weeks before the title's 4th anniversary:

Assuming the entire Forza library has similar four year licenses - i.e.,
  • Forza Horizon released October 23-26 2012, end of life = September 2016?
  • Forza Motorsport 5 released November 22 2013, end of life = October 2017?
  • Forza Horizon 2 released September 30 - October 3 2014, end of life = August 2018?
  • Forza Motorsport 6 released September 15-18 2015, end of life = July 2019?

I am not an employee of T10/Microsoft/affiliates. Use schedule at your own risk.

Edited by user Tuesday, October 13, 2015 11:55:31 AM(UTC)  | Reason: Readability; had to hit the [rewind] button again.

Haven't mastered hitting the apex, which explains my half fast comments.
Rank: Racing Permit
#85 Posted : Monday, October 5, 2015 5:31:16 AM(UTC)
Is there any way to have Microsoft check the FM4 Porsche Expansion Pack license expiration date?

Since Turn10 had to jump through hoops to get licenses for the Porsche expansion pack (released May 22, 2012) it may have a different EOL date than the other DLC. It would be a shame if Microsoft prematurely included this in the EOL.

Edited by user Monday, October 5, 2015 5:36:24 AM(UTC)  | Reason: Reason: Readability; had to hit the [rewind] button again.

Haven't mastered hitting the apex, which explains my half fast comments.
Rank: Driver's Permit
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#86 Posted : Monday, October 5, 2015 2:41:57 PM(UTC)
Forza 4 is one of my favorite racing games of all time. I wanted to gift a Xbox 360 with Forza 4 to a friend so we can play online. We are over 1000 miles away, which makes split screen an impossibility.

The thing he was most excited about was using his car in game. A Scion FR-S. I told him, "no problem, Forza 4 has that as DLC!" I went online to find out how much it would cost, only to come across this mess.

Turn 10 is doing a MAJOR disservice to their fans. Licensing will always be an issue within any industry. I am not upset that they had to pull the content. I am upset that they told no one before it happened. The DLC is what helped define Forza 4 as one of the great racing games of all time. Now no one new will be able to experience that. I also feel incomplete as I was unable to purchase the last couple of car packs.

Turn 10 should really give their fans a small window to purchase the car packs. Even if it means losing money. The good faith they will have earned is well worth it in my opinion.
Rank: Racing Permit
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#87 Posted : Monday, October 5, 2015 4:19:23 PM(UTC)
Here's a copy of a mail I have sent Brian Ekberg. Copy and send from yourself if you feel the same. It MAY be of some use, "the squeaky wheel gets the grease", as they say! Lets show 'em what democracy is all about!


Sorry Brian, but your forum explanation and apology for deletion of the DLC packs for FM4 were complete HOGWASH! You know it and so do most of the people reading it.

On the issue of EOL, there are several problems. The licenses were valid for the PRODUCTION of DLC, and there could be no time limit due to the problem of predicting sales and lifespan of said DLC. The LIFESPAN of a product can only be dictated by sales, and new product development causing conflict in sales. If the DLC or it's original game flops, then the game and it's DLC would be pulled. If it keeps making money at the expense of it's successor the question is do you pull the older game to move the income to the newer game? People aren't completely stupid!

Phil Spencer has made a point of acknowledging Microsoft faults and listening more to the users and fans of the XBox. This must also go for Microsoft Game Studios/Turn10? The XB360 has a huge following STILL, because the games developed for it had value in the eyes of the players. Those players have INVESTED "megabucks" in whole game libraries that would become obsolete if the console is sidelined or neglected and abandoned, Imagine the RESENTMENT, felt by these people toward the brand! The same can be said of game developers. They create a franchise that suspends reality, creates an alternate reality, one inhabited by MILLIONS of players WORLDWIDE! Imagine the same feelings directed toward Turn10! This has a knock-on effect on cosole sales. Why should I even CONSIDER buying the new XBOne, when you can't even look after the console owners you have NOW!?

We live in a world of information, readily available, at our fingertips, and Turn10 are treating their fans of FM4 like imbeciles. It was rude and disrespectful to delete the DLC without warning! It was short sighted and completely wrong to assume it would go unmarked! It was AND STILL IS wrong to assume FM4 and the XB360 are finished. They have a VITAL role to play in being the training console for those hoping to one day own the latest XBOne. ....Please take this back to your weekly meetings and read out loud. I hope SOME sense still prevails in T10 Towers, and that the DLC is returned to the Marketplace, if only for a short while, to give those who had plans to complete their collections and the game a fair crack at the whip this time. If there is a GENUINE problem with licensing, FIRE THE NEGOTIATOR! .... and GIVE IT AWAY!! (The usual workaround for problems like this!)

Ask yourself this question. WHY should I dump another £800+ into next gen consoles, when all I get is the same raw deal from developers of both consoles AND games? Same content! (just more pixels) Same poor customer service! Same lack of respect for the people who put bread in your families mouths! .......SOMETHING HAS TO CHANGE! AND IT MIGHT BE GAMERS GIVING UP ON YOU!
The ultimate petrol-head! 40yrs of obsession! 30yrs of experience!
Rank: Driver's License
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#88 Posted : Monday, October 5, 2015 7:07:23 PM(UTC)
I started enjoying the Forza series with Horizon last summer. From there, i bought FM3 complete edition and FM4. It did not stop there. I purchased an Xbox One specifically for continuing the series. I even bought what many considered the low point, FM5 and enjoyed it. In just a little over a year I played enough to reach tier 6. I even did something i normally refuse; i preordered a game, FM6. I current own all the Forza games with the exception of the original on the original Xbox? I consider myself a fan and a supporter of both the motorsport and horizon series.

I am not much of a tuner, nor much of a painter, so my fun comes from collecting the cars. Now i have the feeling that i have an incomplete game. I will not get to drive cars such as the smart fourtwo or the pacer or the hudson hornet. I believe such cars are missing from other games so i will not even be able to enjoy them elsewhere. My joy comes from knowing that even though i will never really get to drive these cars, i can enjoy them in these games.

I was able to purchase the season pass and Porsche packs earlier, so I do not have as much of a gripe as some of you do. I am sorry for those who were deceived into purchasing tokens or the season pass on sale with the intention of downloading later. It seems as if your money is lost. I feel that most of us agree. We understand licenses expire and legal issues do arise. We simply wish for better communication. A simple message in the game message center would have been satisfactory. Then, we were told that this "was being looked into." I feel as if this was simply stalling. I can assure you that if I communicated as poorly at my job, I would not have a job.

Sorry for the wall of text. Like many of you, I'm simply a frustrated fan of the series. The developers have done some great things (free dlc, unicorns, etc.), but this definately leaves me with a bitter taste.
Rank: Racing Permit
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#89 Posted : Monday, October 5, 2015 9:11:39 PM(UTC)
A quick note that Forza Horizon Season pass is on sale now (50% off), i'll definitely buy it first to have the necessary car pack for 1000 club achievement and also rally expansion which also included.

Grab it before it reach EOL again.....
You'll never play alone!
Rank: Driver's Permit
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#90 Posted : Tuesday, October 6, 2015 2:03:39 AM(UTC)
Simply put, I'm stupidly **** ed that the DLC got pulled, especially since I'm very picky and don't care to play games that I don't feel are complete (or that I can make complete by buying DLC later). Forza 4 is now one of those games, despite being the best of the Xbox 360 lineup of Forza games... It upsets me a whole hell of a lot, I must admit, because this is one of very few franchises in today's absolutely pathetic industry that I actually care a lot about, and to see VERY important content for what's arguably the most important game in the series just pulled without any warning, without a willingness to renegotiate the licenses, etc. is just painful. Unfortunately, despite Forza 2 and Forza 3 getting editions containing all of their DLC, Forza 4 never had such a thing, meaning one of the most important racing games to have come out in the past decade is without a good chunk of its content.

At this point, I'm not even angry like I was yesterday when I found out about this. I'm just sad. I suppose it's pointless to beg, but T10, Microsoft... either renegotiate the licenses or release the content for free. Please. At the very least, do it for the people that bought your season pass and weren't able to use it. Or even just to make money, as the content undoubtedly would, especially once XO's backwards compatibility launches. Or if the free packs route ever happens (which I highly doubt), then, needless to say, that'll build a LOT of good will, which, frankly, both Microsoft and T10 could do with right now. 10 for not telling anybody about this, and Microsoft for continuing to be as Microsoft as it can possibly be.
Rank: Driver's Permit
#91 Posted : Tuesday, October 6, 2015 3:48:58 AM(UTC)
I can't believe Turn10 seem to be ignoring this issue, hoping it goes away.
I for one will not be going back to Forza 6, i am enjoying going back to Forza 4 trying to finish the event list.
I feel that forza 4 being the latest release of the last generation shouldve been supported for longer. hopefully the auction house will stop up for awhile.

Hopefully if it isn't a ploy to get people onto Forza 6 they'll Renegotiate a short license to enable it fans to purchase the content they desire. Even if it doesn't make them a profit. As i could result it people eventually moving onto forza 6.

I doubt anything will happen now, Turn10 seem happy to ignore this issue and attempt to sweep it under the carpet.
Rank: Driver's Permit
#92 Posted : Tuesday, October 6, 2015 10:38:20 AM(UTC)
[Mod Edit - This is a private forum and you're expected to show respect and maturity to the other members and moderators on it. In the future please post your feedback with respect. - D]

Edited by user Tuesday, October 6, 2015 11:22:36 AM(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

Rank: B-Class Racing License
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#93 Posted : Tuesday, October 6, 2015 2:36:45 PM(UTC)
I have FM4 but never really got into it. I prefer FM3. I've started playing FM4 more recently. I looked at buying some DLC and got a message it wasn't available. I assumed the server was down. Now I know FM4 went end of life. That is fine. However, a little warning would have been nice.

This says a lot about the mindset of the people that control the company.

Addition:

I am beginning to think I'm wrong. I thought the company was showing disrespect to its customers. I am now thinking the company was being incompetent or stupid. If Turn 10 had taken the time to send a message to the FM4 users about a month before the EOL, I bet they would have sold thousands if not tens of thousands of copies of the DLCs. They could have had a 10% off sale to increase sales more. People seeing that this was their last chance to get the DLC would have bought it.

What is the cost of sending that one message? What did it cost them not to send it? May be hundreds of thousands of dollars. This doesn't sound like a smart business decision.

Edited by user Tuesday, October 6, 2015 2:54:52 PM(UTC)  | Reason: Addition

Rank: Driver's Permit
#94 Posted : Tuesday, October 6, 2015 2:39:13 PM(UTC)
This especially isn't fair to me who's on a very limited income so buying a Xbox 360 with Forza 4 and a controller for 2 player mode only left us with enough money to buy 2 dlc one of which i basically had to cheat to get to (July Car Pack I'm looking at you) and so this is so cheesily unfair since we got that the month the dlc went off sale so I'm at least stuck with the disc 2 content as well as disc 1 content and the July Car Pack Content i had to cheat to get to, a 1953 Corvette, a Gremlin (which was not worth it even free), and the 1996 Impala, so like no dlc then the first of next month (that's this month cause it's first of next month from last month we get our money i check the Forza 4 dlc and gone i check Forza Horizon 2 (xbox 360 version) as i know from checking the forums that 2 and 3s had been gone for several years already and boom nothing. So is it that they just threw away all the Xbox 360 content once Forza 6 came out and they decided that there were enough for Xbox One to dump on Xbox 360s parade.

*sigh* I guess I'll buy an Xbox One for Forza Motorsports 5, 6 and Horizon 2, and REALLY HOPE Forza Motorsports 2 through 4 become backward compatible once backwards compatibility is a public choice on Xbox One so that hopefully that extends their lifespans.

Edited by user Tuesday, October 6, 2015 2:43:20 PM(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

Rank: Driver's Permit
#95 Posted : Tuesday, October 6, 2015 5:08:06 PM(UTC)
[Mod Edit - Abbreviated profanity, profanity and profanity that is disguised but still alludes to the words are not permitted - D]

Edited by user Wednesday, October 7, 2015 1:29:56 AM(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

Rank: B-Class Racing License
#96 Posted : Tuesday, October 6, 2015 10:25:28 PM(UTC)
A friend on another forum pointed out that the Porsche Pack is available on Amazon, sold by Amazon:

http://www.amazon.com/gp...;s=videogames&sr=1-1

It's full price, but an option for those who really want to buy it.
Rank: C-Class Racing License
#97 Posted : Tuesday, October 6, 2015 10:45:07 PM(UTC)
Originally Posted by: JDawgg77 Go to Quoted Post
A friend on another forum pointed out that the Porsche Pack is available on Amazon, sold by Amazon:

http://www.amazon.com/gp...;s=videogames&sr=1-1

It's full price, but an option for those who really want to buy it.


Will it actually work though? I'd assume it wouldn't, but would totally buy it if I knew it was going to work.
Rank: Racing Permit
#98 Posted : Wednesday, October 7, 2015 12:25:03 AM(UTC)
Digital code should not work if the DLC is removed at store. That's the same case when FM3 removed all DLC and i've got the car pack code but can't redeem.
You'll never play alone!
Rank: B-Class Racing License
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#99 Posted : Wednesday, October 7, 2015 5:53:17 AM(UTC)
Most of the time when an item is removed from the store codes for that item still work. Rare exceptions include Double Dragon and FM3 content. When FM3 content disappeared it was no longer available by code or to redownload thru download history, but that was fixed shortly afterwards. Last I heard the only code that still doesn't work for FM3 is the Stig Pack. People are selling the FM3 VIP code for $30 to $70 online and people state it worked when they bought it.

Here's what the guy said:

PsiScream, on 06 Oct 2015 - 10:08 PM, said:

I also managed to get and install the Porsche Expansion Pack from Amazon It's full price, but hey, late to the party.

Inspired by this success I also picked up the bonus track and car pack DLC from this guy on eBay. Code worked and installed: http://www.ebay.com/...=item19f2e47d21

Sorting through my stack of misc codes that I haven't used, I found the one for the September Pennzoil car pack, and the pre-order bonus Dodge Challenger SRT8 392.

When all was said and done, I think I have most of the DLC content apart from the Alpinestars pack, and 4 of the $7 car packs. Not bad for a game that's been pulled from the Marketplace!

Edited by user Wednesday, October 7, 2015 11:21:59 AM(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

Rank: Racing Permit
#100 Posted : Wednesday, October 7, 2015 10:54:50 AM(UTC)
Originally Posted by: JimB3 Go to Quoted Post
.... If Turn 10 had taken the time to send a message to the FM4 users about a month before the EOL, I bet they would have sold thousands if not tens of thousands of copies of the DLCs. They could have had a 10% off sale to increase sales more. People seeing that this was their last chance to get the DLC would have bought it.

What is the cost of sending that one message? What did it cost them not to send it? May be hundreds of thousands of dollars. This doesn't sound like a smart business decision.

ManteoMax's initial post in this thread reveals Turn10 wasn't initially aware why FM4 DLC content had been removed from the Microsoft store, which suggests Microsoft pulled the content without giving T10 a heads up. You'd expect them act as a single company regarding content availability but apparently this isn't the case.

I agree T10 could have provided better customer and/or cashed out by messaging before the FM4 DLC ended, but they either didn't have the info, or prioritized fixing FM6 bugs.
Haven't mastered hitting the apex, which explains my half fast comments.
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