Rank: Driver's Permit
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#1 Posted : Thursday, September 3, 2020 5:02:29 AM(UTC)
Hi, I know that there is already a post about Ranking system being broken, but I also want to share my experience.

I'm always getting solo queued with legaue from 16 to 7, if no one quits the lobby, my points stay unaffected but when there's someone who quits, I'm getting from -1 to even -3 points based on how much people left my lobby.

Video proof

I hope someone at PGG and this forum cares about this mess
Rank: S-Class Racing License
 1 user liked this post.
#2 Posted : Thursday, September 3, 2020 5:56:47 AM(UTC)
Originally Posted by: Skajdrovski Go to Quoted Post
Hi, I know that there is already a post about Ranking system being broken, but I also want to share my experience.

I'm always getting solo queued with legaue from 16 to 7, if no one quits the lobby, my points stay unaffected but when there's someone who quits, I'm getting from -1 to even -3 points based on how much people left my lobby.

Video proof

I hope someone at PGG and this forum cares about this mess


I've played you a few times and lost to you all of them I think, before I figured out how to preview the lobby and now when I see your name come up I skip... sorry :p
Rank: A-Class Racing License
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#3 Posted : Thursday, September 3, 2020 5:59:27 AM(UTC)
Common problem for high ranked players Skaj (and welcome to the forum). See by the way the overall “ranked adventure” thread in the stickies at the top of the page. Seems to be exacerbated by the matchmaking changes.

I was thinking about this earlier and I actually think a lot of the issues with FFA scoring would be fixed by having a guaranteed +1 minimum for any adventure. That solves the bad matchmaking as, at least, you are getting some reward for doing a dirt lobby with 5 beginners. It also balances the heavy penalty for losing to someone lower ranked and probably more or less covers the damage of getting a random d/c per month. That simple small change would make it so much better.
Rank: Driver's Permit
#4 Posted : Thursday, September 3, 2020 6:16:59 AM(UTC)
Originally Posted by: Jezza14 Go to Quoted Post


I was thinking about this earlier and I actually think a lot of the issues with FFA scoring would be fixed by having a guaranteed +1 minimum for any adventure. That solves the bad matchmaking


This, this message should get sent to Devs

Rank: S-Class Racing License
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#5 Posted : Thursday, September 3, 2020 6:23:35 AM(UTC)
I notice that a lot of the top players only play once a month. I wonder if some sort of system can't be devised where these GM 'squatters' for want of a better word, lose points over time for not participating. I don't mean resetting them to zero, but maybe slowly draining them somehow, to incentivise them to play more, so the rest of us have more opportunities to win more points than we do currently. (Also, those of us who play a lot could have the system recognise that by rewarding us for every match we participate in like Jezza says, to at least get rid of all those zeroes and minus scores we currently get for winning against weak opponents.)

Edited by user Thursday, September 3, 2020 6:27:35 AM(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

Rank: A-Class Racing License
#6 Posted : Thursday, September 3, 2020 7:40:43 AM(UTC)
I don’t think I’d really be in favour of that approach FN. A requirement to play lots to avoid your ranking being drained sounds highly punitive!

The real problem is there aren’t enough players in the higher ranks. I usually get +1 for beating a League 5. Presently, that’s someone ranked about 300 in the world (250 or so below me), just outside the top 1%, but the game regards it as someone four leagues below me. A league 5 against a League 9 (I.e, the same type of gap) is facing someone 3,000 places below them in the rankings so it makes a lot more sense for them to get low points in that scenario. As it is, there’s probably only about 500 people playing the game who I get any points for beating - a lot of whom don’t play regularly and some of whom are selective about who they race against.
Rank: S-Class Racing License
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#7 Posted : Thursday, September 3, 2020 8:14:44 AM(UTC)
Maybe you're right, I mean I was only thinking of a very small points loss though. I was just trying to think if there was some way to make it more equitable. Maybe there should just be more carrot like you said (a small guaranteed points gain for winning, regardless of against whom) rather than stick then.

Certainly when the system is making it this hard for elite players who ALSO play a LOT, like yourself, DRC, Skajdrovski etc. to become GM, then the system is too unforgiving and needs some sort of tweaking somewhere. I'd leave it to those more knowledgeable with these things to figure out quite exactly what though!
Rank: D-Class Racing License
#8 Posted : Thursday, September 3, 2020 9:57:31 AM(UTC)
Originally Posted by: FullNietzsche Go to Quoted Post
I notice that a lot of the top players only play once a month. I wonder if some sort of system can't be devised where these GM 'squatters' for want of a better word, lose points over time for not participating. I don't mean resetting them to zero, but maybe slowly draining them somehow, to incentivise them to play more, so the rest of us have more opportunities to win more points than we do currently. (Also, those of us who play a lot could have the system recognise that by rewarding us for every match we participate in like Jezza says, to at least get rid of all those zeroes and minus scores we currently get for winning against weak opponents.)

But skipping adventures is OK? ;)

IMO fix for points is:
1. Fixed points for finishing position - like +10pts for 1st, +6 for 2nd and so on + points awarded from current system - so even if you race against bunch of rank 20 players end finish with negative points it would sum up in positive points.
2. Requirement of 10 ranked adventures per month or you lose 10pts from your rank - with current quick matchmaking + points like above it is not that much.

+3. credit goes to Tilo38 - ghosting after longer side-to-side contact. (for me it would be like 2 seconds of "continuous" contact)


Rank: S-Class Racing License
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#9 Posted : Thursday, September 3, 2020 11:31:23 AM(UTC)
Come to think of it, isn't what I was suggesting, something similar to what happens in some professional sports? If you're world boxing champion, you have to keep fighting contenders or you'll lose your belts. If you're a top tennis player, your rank goes up the more you play and win. If you just won one title and then sat it out for the rest of the season, you'd slip down the rankings by your inactivity.

I dunno, obviously the devil would be in the detail but I reckon the principle has some merit... maybe :p
Rank: R-Class Racing License
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#10 Posted : Thursday, September 3, 2020 6:28:42 PM(UTC)
This is why I don't bother. Not worth the time and effort and the amount of abuse I would have to take from other drivers required to get a hat, a t-shirt and bragging rights. Not to mention wasting time having to find a new group of people every single time. I guess they do that so a lobby isn't filled with friends but really it is annoying nonetheless. Anyone reach Grand Master from PGG? Is it easier to do?

Edited by user Thursday, September 3, 2020 6:40:30 PM(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

Rank: A-Class Racing License
#11 Posted : Friday, September 4, 2020 4:34:55 AM(UTC)
There’s 22 players currently at GM level for FFA, 44 players for drift, 69 for Team Games and the maximum 100 at Team Adventure. I’m not ranked at TG or drift, so can’t check the number of people who are actually ranked but I suspect that is probably a fair reflection of the difficulty. It’s brutally hard to get GM level at FFA.
Rank: S-Class Racing License
#12 Posted : Friday, September 4, 2020 6:57:51 AM(UTC)
So by my maths, currently the GM percentages are:

Team Adventure, top 0.25%

Free-for-all, top 0.08%

If the ratio for FFA was the same as TA, the top 66 in FFA would be GM.
Rank: D-Class Racing License
#13 Posted : Saturday, September 5, 2020 8:15:53 AM(UTC)
Originally Posted by: leetorts Go to Quoted Post
This is why I don't bother. Not worth the time and effort and the amount of abuse I would have to take from other drivers required to get a hat, a t-shirt and bragging rights. Not to mention wasting time having to find a new group of people every single time. I guess they do that so a lobby isn't filled with friends but really it is annoying nonetheless. Anyone reach Grand Master from PGG? Is it easier to do?


Currently at Rank 5, I play once each season to ease the qualification for the playlist exclusive cars. Everyone leaves since Season 17 as they don't want the opposing team to earn points as well as have their points being deducted. People who stayed on the losing team were being penalised as well before the bugged update (imo fair update) when someone on their team left against a stronger team. In short, the whole ranked online multiplayer doesn't work with a 5000 Ranked points. It should be more than that to make the grind less painful and even out the playing field. I just hopped on today morning to qualify myself and the whole opposing team left, jamming up the sync procedure after each match resulting in a 5 minute delay for that round's results.

Getting ranked in team racing or FFA is easier than in team games. I've switched to WRC9 and rank online events is better in my opinion. Oddly enough, every single concurrent post that appears magically on the forums seeking for a restoration of the old system for team games - where nitrous were used to speed your way through grandmaster. And yes, there are people using nitrous in team games as well, if you assumed only racing/rivals had them.

With xbox Project xCloud, XSX and the current update as well as the pandemic, the team can be assumed to be on pressure to deliver for their prime focus - XSX support, you can only hope for ranked to get fixed.

Edited by user Saturday, September 5, 2020 8:57:52 AM(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

Rank: Racing Permit
#14 Posted : Monday, September 7, 2020 8:44:18 AM(UTC)
If people were not forced to play online, you would have less problems. Most of us don't want to play online at all, but we are forced to do it every month.

Tell Playground to remove the monthly online races from the festival playlist, and i am sure you will see the amount of quitters go down.

I get bored and ram people for the hell of it, just waiting for the race to be over.

Think i am rank 15, but it can be rank 99999 for all i care. I really just don't want to do it.

Edited by user Monday, September 7, 2020 8:47:29 AM(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

Rank: S-Class Racing License
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#15 Posted : Monday, September 7, 2020 9:44:40 AM(UTC)
Originally Posted by: RavingWolfy Go to Quoted Post

I get bored and ram people for the hell of it, just waiting for the race to be over.


If you are just playing ranked team adventure to get re-ranked then you don't need to finish the adventure, you can just start the first race and then quit immediately it begins, and you will get a rank, and fulfill the playlist requirement.

I'm not suggesting people should do that, but it's definitely better than ramming people.
Rank: D-Class Racing License
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#16 Posted : Monday, September 7, 2020 12:56:07 PM(UTC)
Originally Posted by: RavingWolfy Go to Quoted Post
I get bored and ram people for the hell of it, just waiting for the race to be over.

Think i am rank 15, but it can be rank 99999 for all i care. I really just don't want to do it.


I just don't understand the philosophy of "I don't enjoy a thing, so I will make you not enjoy it either"

It's one thing to wall-bomb and crash out AI. In this last Trial, I even said how I enjoyed using the limousine to hold up, and run the AI into barriers and such to slow them up for my teammates. But to intentionally make it annoying for others, who might actually be trying to accomplish a thing, is just petty and selfish. I have no stake in this, I run the Online Adventure only to complete the mandatory minimums. And I do all four types just cuz. But it isn't that difficult to maintain a modicum of decency.

Rank: Racing Permit
#17 Posted : Monday, September 7, 2020 2:54:39 PM(UTC)
Originally Posted by: IngoingCake8592 Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: RavingWolfy Go to Quoted Post
I get bored and ram people for the hell of it, just waiting for the race to be over.

Think i am rank 15, but it can be rank 99999 for all i care. I really just don't want to do it.


I just don't understand the philosophy of "I don't enjoy a thing, so I will make you not enjoy it either"

It's one thing to wall-bomb and crash out AI. In this last Trial, I even said how I enjoyed using the limousine to hold up, and run the AI into barriers and such to slow them up for my teammates. But to intentionally make it annoying for others, who might actually be trying to accomplish a thing, is just petty and selfish. I have no stake in this, I run the Online Adventure only to complete the mandatory minimums. And I do all four types just cuz. But it isn't that difficult to maintain a modicum of decency.



You admit to ramming and under handed tricks, then rush to distance yourself from any wrong doing in the very next sentence?

Yeah, I can sense You sweating from here :/



You force people to do things they don't want to do, this is what happens.

Only way to 100% the festival playlist is to complete multiplayer once a month, with the epeen waving idiots fighting over a virtual trophy in ranked.

Blame Playground for the quitters and rammers, this was their grand design after all.

Edited by user Monday, September 7, 2020 3:35:08 PM(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

Rank: D-Class Racing License
#18 Posted : Monday, September 7, 2020 9:31:04 PM(UTC)
Originally Posted by: RavingWolfy Go to Quoted Post
You admit to ramming and under handed tricks, then rush to distance yourself from any wrong doing in the very next sentence?

Yeah, I can sense You sweating from here :/

Um, yeah, you sure figured me out. Can't put anything past you. Except perhaps the definition of AI.



Originally Posted by: RavingWolfy Go to Quoted Post
You force people to do things they don't want to do, this is what happens.
Only way to 100% the festival playlist is to complete multiplayer once a month...
Blame Playground for the quitters and rammers, this was their grand design after all.


Um, no one is forced. You choose to do it. You don't need 100% for the rewards, only 80% which you can do without Online Adventure completely. And if you do choose to do it, it's 1 race series every 30 days. Hardly an imposition. So I don't blame Playground for the quitters and the rammers, I blame the quitters and the rammers. They do that of their own volition.



Rank: S-Class Racing License
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#19 Posted : Monday, September 7, 2020 11:21:01 PM(UTC)
Originally Posted by: RavingWolfy Go to Quoted Post
You admit to ramming and under handed tricks, then rush to distance yourself from any wrong doing in the very next sentence?

Yeah, I can sense You sweating from here :/


Are you really suggesting that ramming AI is the same as ramming real people whose races you may be ruining. The AI don't care if they are rammed, because they aren't real mate.
Rank: A-Class Racing License
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#20 Posted : Tuesday, September 8, 2020 2:57:50 AM(UTC)
This has gone slightly off topic but I blame PGG for the quitters and rammers only to the extent that they have enabled them. The majority of quitters are due to the broken points system, not due to a lack of desire to do ranked (they are quitting precisely because they don’t want to lose ranking points) and the rammers haven’t previously been punished enough.

However, ultimately each rammer or quitter is entirely free to make their own decision as to whether to drive fairly or not and it’s the individuals concerned who are primarily at fault. You can blame PGG for making you do 5-10 minutes of ranked racing a month to get the precious 100% but it’s not PGG’s fault if you then decide to spend that 5-10 minutes ramming people because you are bored.
Rank: C-Class Racing License
#21 Posted : Tuesday, September 8, 2020 7:41:36 PM(UTC)
Originally Posted by: FullNietzsche Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: RavingWolfy Go to Quoted Post

I get bored and ram people for the hell of it, just waiting for the race to be over.


If you are just playing ranked team adventure to get re-ranked then you don't need to finish the adventure, you can just start the first race and then quit immediately it begins, and you will get a rank, and fulfill the playlist requirement.

I'm not suggesting people should do that, but it's definitely better than ramming people.


I did not know this. This is the best news I have heard all day. Wish I would have known this like a year ago.
Rank: S-Class Racing License
#22 Posted : Wednesday, September 9, 2020 1:12:18 AM(UTC)
Bear in mind it may take a while for it to actually show up, I assume it will take until the match you just quit has ended. But it does work because I did it this month. (I did it purely because getting a rank was the only way to find out how many players were in ranked team adventure on the leaderboard, which it doesn't tell you unless you yourself have qualified.)

Edited by user Wednesday, September 9, 2020 1:12:57 AM(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

Rank: A-Class Racing License
#23 Posted : Thursday, September 10, 2020 3:07:37 AM(UTC)
Good job getting to 4850 Skajdrovski 👍. 29th ranked in FFA 😎.
Rank: S-Class Racing License
#24 Posted : Thursday, September 10, 2020 4:14:36 AM(UTC)
Very nice, well done.
Rank: Driver's Permit
#25 Posted : Saturday, September 12, 2020 8:42:52 AM(UTC)

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