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That was fixed many weeks ago.

Maybe have it so only FE cars are locked behind exclusive rewards with non FE versions readily available so entire car types are not permalocked from people for no good reason. I'd happily throw away a + credit boost or whatever if i could get some cool car I liked in a standard base format.

While we're at it, remove any non FE cars from wheelspins too, crown vics arent that rare that they need to be dumped behind a fake number generator

Makes sense in principle, but would only really work if the FE variants were completely identical to the non-FE cars other than the FE bonus. Right now, this is not at all the case and many of the FE cars have significantly different stats and available upgrades available to the point that they're completely different vehicles in most cases.

Well, those of us who have value in the special unlocks, special wheelspin exclusives, mutiplay etc. Have offered plenty of ways to give concessions to those that don't. If even just having the FE be special earnings is too much and wont give up that, then the discussion wont go anywhere further. Want everything attainable in single play but "leave the junk we don't want as multiplayer bonuses" is when it gets to a point that is is all a case of "give me, but wont give you!"

In terms of festival, the problem has been pretty well pointed out.

To get 100% award cars requires everybody to play the exact same way

It was time limited with everybody requiring the exact same way in a well intended award. It wasn't asking for stuff extreme. Just a regular play award for what already existed, but just too much of it without any leeway.

Solutions have been shared. Give a buffer, or bring a bonus for skills into the mix to allow versatility in proceeding to objective. As soon as it can be gotten casually whenever, it no longer has collectibility value as a play objective and drops the interest value in play. Every type of play needs a top tier objective to shoot for and in extreme cases, there are alternatives to earn them. Instant gratification only rewards do not make for a healthy game longterm no do things where you can farmgrind your way to it.

As for FE, Outside of a couple cars, almost nobody cares about the special bonus. Make them identical in every way aside from a black plate and that bonus to the base car? Well now the FE car has no value making it a worthless reward.... well worth only what you can buy it for and becoming autoshow cars plus wheelspins means not much.

Edited by user Monday, March 11, 2019 4:32:01 PM(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

Basically, I don't want to have to do ANY of the seasonal rubbish or Forzathon live or the daily/weekly Forzathon challenges. To me, they're all just taking time away that I'd rather spend playing the game the way I want to.

Developing a set of cars for online racing is a massive job. It takes around 5 hours to give a car a good test, trying multiple builds and tunes on a decent number of courses. If a car seems particularly outstanding I might spend an extra 10 hours or more trying to eek out every last drop of performance. So with 500 cars, you're looking at 2500 hours just to test every car for a single class. For 3 classes, 7500 hours of work (though it wouldn't be as much as that as some cars can't hit some PIs or it becomes clear quite quickly they're not going to be good at some things). Yet despite giving us that massive job to do, they want us, on top of that, to do all this other stuff that is just completely irrelevant.

It has been annoying to have to do the stuff up till now, but has just about been tolerable because I've just been ignoring anything that doesn't give a new exclusive car, so it hasn't taken up all that much time each week. But being made to do all that rubbish just to unlock one car, it really is the last straw.

I know RK says she plays the game, but I bet she hasn't even tried to build/tune a single car to be the absolute best it can be for a particular class. I still think none of the staff must be trying to do that 7500 hour task, or they'd understand why people don't want to be given all this rubbish to do on top, and they'd also understand why it's so infuriating to not be able to race without drivatars, or to download tunes from rivals leaderboards, which would massively reduce the size of the job.

My solution: no cars that can give an advantage for online competition should ever be locked, full stop. By all means reward people with clothes, quickchat phrases, car paintjobs, FE versions provided they perform identically. But everyone should be able to get hold of any car that turns out to be the best for online competition. I don't understand how PG have got this so wrong when T10 seemed to have grasped it perfectly with FM7.

Breeminator, That is a serious bit of overzealous logic that not even I can follow. 7500hours? So there shouldn't be a reward because you want a perfect tune for every car in game? I mean, yeah, do what you want but a challenge shouldnt exist simply because do not want to actually do any of the races?

No offence, but that is a pretty bad arguement since that is just a personal project in the game. Almost all challenges can be done top difficulties with a 15 minute build and drive. Heck, most championships have of late been able to beat without even a test drive. The past couple trials I built a car, set to some settings normal for my driving taste, made sure toe was to a steering responsiveness I like and on my way to first place.

Okay, debating the different actual gameplay mechanics? Fine and dandy. Is what I was doing. But when the point doesn't even involve playing the game, that is where I am lost. You don't like any aspect of play at all? Just want the top times on leaderboards?

It goes to what I said before. Only so much leeway can go into a game. Longer term investment objectives promote and maintain healthy play if implemented right. You say that play should get nothing at all instead of novelties? I mean... what what what? Go to beam NG! Can free roam and download/mod etc all the cars you like! Talk to people about auction house earnings. Weasel way to legendary and in a couple weeks you will have enough credits to buy every car in existence.

As for "advantage in online play" That isn't the car. It is imbalances in the PI weighting. The PI system is driven by the game mechanics so no car has a magical advantage outside of having a slight better base value on the underweighted attributes. If you spend so much time tuning cars, have you ever submitted a detailed report and discussion to the forza staff on what is imbalanced and why, your testing methods that have come to that? If not, then really cannot complain about some car being overpowered. The only way that can be narrowed down is through wide sourced and high sample testing. It is impossible to do in a development build.

I mean, they don't want you to do all that on top of obsessive tuning. It is clearly supposed to be a part of normal play most do with a bit extra? I play while doing my route creations and posting in discussions here. Time management man!

"Nobody is allowed to have any rewards for playing anymore! We must hand out everything to people who dont play!"

Edited by user Monday, March 11, 2019 5:57:29 PM(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

You don't have to respond to every single post you do not agree with guys. It's getting really old. Same people have to disagree for the fun of it I guess. People are allowed differing opinions than yours. That is the idea of a forum. You like where they are going, great. The are departing from everything a lot of Forza veterans and I liked about Horizon. I'm annoyed. Sue me.

Edited by user Monday, March 11, 2019 6:13:12 PM(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

Yes, online competition is all that interests me in the game. The AI is really easy to beat, even on unbeatable, so what is the point of racing against them?

If you aren't interested in online competition, why do you even care about the locked cars? If I was only interested in the single player game, I'd have no interest at all in unlocking any of the locked cars as I'd have no use for them. The people who want to focus on online competition are the people who can't afford to miss out on the next Bone Shaker or Mosler.

Well in a way, this is sort of the other extreme example I was meaning. How what rewards do you get for all your multiplayer stuff? If all you got for all your effort is a hat, there would be of course the gratification of that rank, but having some sort of trophy to show would be better, no? There is no one player more valued than another if playing. If you were only interested in the single player game, you would be interested in unlockable cars just as much, but for different reasons.

So to answer your question, why am I interested? Cause I like cars. It is why if you ever saw me in game, it would probably be in something odd. It is why I do route creation, just for a bit of fun. I like multiplayer, but for the fun of friendly sport over stressing to be the best. Much as you say you would have no value in the cars in single player, I do not put value on rankings. Lists for top times and such? Worthless to me. So once again it comes around to understanding the perspective of the other players. The different ways of playing are all valid, and as such, so is them having opportunities to earn rewards that way.

This is where the Monthly Playlist challenge can offer so much. With just some fine tweaking, it means that all the different players could shoot for the same goal. Yeah, it would mean that would need to branch out, but that is part of monthly challenges. Mixing up play, but it does need to still offer some choice.

If they want a car to stay reasonably rare, I think the worst way to go about that is to read 100+ pages critical of the multiplayer experience, THEN choose to hide cars behind multiplayer before improving it, and coupling that with grading on attendance. That's straight up offensive.

There are less controversial features to hide cars behind, like single player, and why are we graded on attendance? Are we getting charged per minute? I'm glad I don't let Microsoft have my credit card number. I think if it was a challenge that didn't force people into a mosh pit of prepubescents and allowed people to work on it at their own pace, I think there'd be less of a problem. Gold guns in old COD: They set a challenge and let you work on it whenever. They didn't say you need to play every day and complete all tasks by the first wolf moon or else you're Sure Outta Luck.

Edited by user Monday, March 11, 2019 8:14:15 PM(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

I play offline and I'm interested in the locked cars simply because I like collecting and trying out all the vehicles at my own pace. Agree with everything you've said so far on this thread though about the issues with exclusive locked vehicles even if my reasons for wanting them are different.

Well this is still after all car game and many guy here loves cars even when they are not competive in online, that old cadillac for example i really like cruising around with that one. I have also collector nature so i like collect every car that is possible.

After all we all are different kinda peoples and enjoy different kinda things, while you are intersted only what is best meta car to use in online i like more to use cars what i like to drive, like trial event sometimes ago you notice that maserati dominates that disicpline rivals event while i look stats on cars in autoshow "well it seems that maserati would be fastest" but i pick DBS because i like that car more.

I'm just here to say one thing, make this playlist single-player friendly and take away daily challenges being part of the progression. That's what I get from those who argue about the system

I thought a little about players that like single-player more and want to be all car rewards be obtainable through SP and about players that think there should be an exclusive car rewards for MP.

I think, there's a way how to satisfy everybody, and also, I don't understand why it was not done from the beginning. There's a lot of Horizon Edition cars that can help to boost up the skills. So I think, that all Horizon Edition cars should be as online rewards only. They're exclusive, they boost up the skills, they have much more tuning potential, they are very useful for those who enjoys MP.

At the same time I'm pretty sure that all of the SP players, that enjoy the game in their own pace and just want to relax and to have fun, don't need these Horizon Edition cars too much. These players mostly just want to test drive all the standard cars. They haven't any interest to max out the cars. They just want to chill. So, all the non-HE car should be obtainable without MP.

I think it would be pretty nice, if HE-cars were obtainable through MP only, and all standard cars were obtainable through SP. In that case MP players would still have their exclusive cars rewards, while all SP players could play in their own pace to obtain all stanard cars they want.

Edited by user Monday, March 11, 2019 9:40:49 PM(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

For the Lamborghini Trial a while back, I used the Jarama in order to have fun. Was like a puzzle trying to get something different competitive. The fun really is in the options for a game like this. Take away the options, it takes away what really makes it special.

@Acino, I agree with you as well. I think that if the car a player uses is also essentially a trophy, that is a pretty awesome way to flex. There will be the PvE collector players that will have issue, but then there is still an auction. Most likely players would start selling the PvE/farmable valuable cars to those who spend most time in multiplayer, and then buy the HE edition cars. An indirect barter system between the two ways of play for those that are on the extreme ends of MP vs SP.

Edited by user Monday, March 11, 2019 9:44:06 PM(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

That statement makes no sense
Daily challenges are always single player friendly

It's for those who said they have time that they can't get on the game. If you read through all post you'll see what I meant

Edited by user Tuesday, March 12, 2019 2:46:33 AM(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

Is somebody say that those are not single player friendly? Making single player friendly is nothing to do abaout daily challenges. Daily challenges being part of 100% completion is huge middle finger for those peoples who cant play game ever 72 hours.

[quote=breeminator; everyone should be able to get hold of any car that turns out to be the best for online competition.[/quote]

Now this, I agree with

I'll never even use the [Mod Edit] RTRs which nae one cares about, that much is true. But the GTR, which requires 100% completion, is the one a truly want - and so does the community.
Rather than make it the 50% reward which would've been more enticing, no, they lock it behind the most time-consuming, rage-inducing requirement. They're just [Mod Edit] mocking us at this point pal.
Even FM7 had the most wanted cars as a mid-level reward - and it was fine. This ? Nae so much.

Edited by user Tuesday, March 12, 2019 5:17:16 AM(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

I'm out of town for 4 days next quarter. Please explain, in detail, the workaround for that.

I'm not sure if it's clear how it will work yet, but if part of the playlist is getting the weekly bonus for 7 dailies, then you'll need to play it during a specific 24 hours every week.

People who emphasize the sense of achievement are bothersome.

As with other games, after a year or so, you can do something with a limited car car pack.

However, this game has too many limited cars. You have to attend an event just like a Japanese smartphone game. What is the reason why you have to addict the player so far?

The measure of relative performance is all I need. It gives me something to try to improve and lets me measure whether I'm improving or not. I have the "I beat Josef Newgarden" trophy from FM7, but can't even remember what it is, to be honest. I do remember that I had to be inside something like the top 0.7% in those two rivals to win whatever the rewards were.