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Rank: Driver's Permit
 4 users liked this post.
#1 Posted : Monday, November 5, 2018 12:36:23 AM(UTC)
Limited Aggression on or off, lowest difficulty or highest, this is the most garbage AI I have ever seen in a racing game. The main campaign is practically unplayable when I keep getting pitted by a car on rails because it feels like occupying the same space as me for no appreciable reason. I watch them crash into each other at the beginning of races, drive into walls for no reason, cut into the back of cars on the proper line because they don't know how to be off that line for more than two femtoseconds.

Seriously, between this and the fact that FH4 is literally unplayable because it crashes every ten minutes, it's a wonder anyone still pays money for these games.

[Mod Edit - Abbreviated profanity, profanity and profanity that is disguised but still alludes to the words are not permitted - D]

Edited by user Tuesday, November 6, 2018 12:40:46 PM(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

Rank: A-Class Racing License
 1 user liked this post.
#2 Posted : Monday, November 5, 2018 1:37:24 AM(UTC)
Since the release of the game (I bought the ultimate edition), I had no problems with the AI at all. I usually played on Professional/Unbeatable with long races duration and I managed to get clean and good racing against the drivatars. Just some caution to not be in their lines. I nearly completed the Forza Cup (first round, didn't unlocked the second round yet).

BUT, last week I tried to advance a bit more on the completion since a break of two or three months and I found that they were ramming me with no reason, in braking zones, etc. They didn't do that before.

Maybe they tried to fix something in a recent update and mess the things up?
Rank: Driver's Permit
 1 user liked this post.
#3 Posted : Monday, November 5, 2018 2:01:01 AM(UTC)
Originally Posted by: Kesselring1987 Go to Quoted Post
Since the release of the game (I bought the ultimate edition), I had no problems with the AI at all. I usually played on Professional/Unbeatable with long races duration and I managed to get clean and good racing against the drivatars. Just some caution to not be in their lines. I nearly completed the Forza Cup (first round, didn't unlocked the second round yet).

BUT, last week I tried to advance a bit more on the completion since a break of two or three months and I found that they were ramming me with no reason, in braking zones, etc. They didn't do that before.

Maybe they tried to fix something in a recent update and mess the things up?


It's possible, but I've been pretty aware of it since the beginning. I, too, have the ultimate edition, and have been playing off and on from the start. I just had two races back to back together though that illustrate my point.

First race, track I'd never driven on before, I'm around the pack in about 30 seconds, with a couple little nudges, then I'm history. End up lapping half the field in a 15 lap race.

The next race, in the exact same car, with the exact same difficulty settings, on a track I am familiar with, the AI is bouncing all over the place, punting each other, punting me, and has now magically become incredibly fast. I chased the first place car for two laps before finally being able to make a move.

Next race, back in front almost immediately, for my 15 minute pleasure cruise with no drama at all. It doesn't make sense.

The worst part, though, is if you get caught up with one of them and they push you off the track, they'll just keep pushing and pushing and make it impossible to recover. That's the most frustrating thing. I've been pushed sideways into walls so many times.

Edited by user Monday, November 5, 2018 2:04:50 AM(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

Rank: B-Class Racing License
#4 Posted : Monday, November 5, 2018 4:40:59 AM(UTC)
Maybe I'm a rare one but the AI is nearly perfect for me. In fact at times I've had to drop the difficulty from unbeatable to pro just to come in the top 5. It also depends on the division, slower cars I'm better at coming in the top 3 or 5 but race type cars I'm usually in the middle of the pack fighting my way up. Now occasionally they do some silly things like drive off the track or stop and pile up near a turn but driving wise I rarely have issues with them.
Rank: B-Class Racing License
 5 users liked this post.
#5 Posted : Monday, November 5, 2018 6:34:32 AM(UTC)
The AI isn't perfect but still better than every other racing game I've played in my life.
Rank: C-Class Racing License
 1 user liked this post.
#6 Posted : Monday, November 5, 2018 6:49:52 AM(UTC)
Originally Posted by: Braindead NL Go to Quoted Post
The AI isn't perfect but still better than every other racing game I've played in my life.



Ho-ho, that must be the joke of the century. Even GTA has better AI than FM7

Gt: fairlane305
Rank: D-Class Racing License
#7 Posted : Monday, November 5, 2018 6:58:45 AM(UTC)
Originally Posted by: Kesselring1987 Go to Quoted Post
Since the release of the game (I bought the ultimate edition), I had no problems with the AI at all. I usually played on Professional/Unbeatable with long races duration and I managed to get clean and good racing against the drivatars. Just some caution to not be in their lines. I nearly completed the Forza Cup (first round, didn't unlocked the second round yet).

BUT, last week I tried to advance a bit more on the completion since a break of two or three months and I found that they were ramming me with no reason, in braking zones, etc. They didn't do that before.

Maybe they tried to fix something in a recent update and mess the things up?


I have been playing exclusively on unbeatable difficulty, but AI has nothing to do with the name Drivatars (and it's concept), except the names of AI. Since we are restricted by homologation, it's bizzare that AI can brake those rules, as they get more power then what the regulation states (as they are much faster on straits in the came car). this is most apparent in SEBRING 300 showcase (at least they should allow us to tune Ford GT40).

When using Unbeatable, if you are consistent, you will catch them by the last 2 laps (on long races), which means that AI is slowing down each lap.

Rank: Driver's Permit
 1 user liked this post.
#8 Posted : Friday, November 9, 2018 12:35:20 PM(UTC)
Originally Posted by: Dzidza1978 Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: Kesselring1987 Go to Quoted Post
Since the release of the game (I bought the ultimate edition), I had no problems with the AI at all. I usually played on Professional/Unbeatable with long races duration and I managed to get clean and good racing against the drivatars. Just some caution to not be in their lines. I nearly completed the Forza Cup (first round, didn't unlocked the second round yet).

BUT, last week I tried to advance a bit more on the completion since a break of two or three months and I found that they were ramming me with no reason, in braking zones, etc. They didn't do that before.

Maybe they tried to fix something in a recent update and mess the things up?


I have been playing exclusively on unbeatable difficulty, but AI has nothing to do with the name Drivatars (and it's concept), except the names of AI. Since we are restricted by homologation, it's bizzare that AI can brake those rules, as they get more power then what the regulation states (as they are much faster on straits in the came car). this is most apparent in SEBRING 300 showcase (at least they should allow us to tune Ford GT40).

When using Unbeatable, if you are consistent, you will catch them by the last 2 laps (on long races), which means that AI is slowing down each lap.



It isn't that the AI is too fast or impossible to beat, it's that it has absolutely no awareness of the cars around it. It will happily cut across the track and ram you into a wall, or spin you out, or otherwise damage your car, even though you should be clearly visible to it. It is the most frustrating experience.

And to the guy that said this is the best AI in racing games? That's the best joke I've heard in a while.
Rank: A-Class Racing License
#9 Posted : Saturday, November 10, 2018 12:46:36 PM(UTC)
Originally Posted by: SgtHop Go to Quoted Post
It isn't that the AI is too fast or impossible to beat, it's that it has absolutely no awareness of the cars around it. It will happily cut across the track and ram you into a wall, or spin you out, or otherwise damage your car, even though you should be clearly visible to it. It is the most frustrating experience.

And to the guy that said this is the best AI in racing games? That's the best joke I've heard in a while.


Exactly this. I've been playing racing games since Pitstop II on the C64 (and "driving" ones since Night Driver on the VIC-20). I don't recall many other games, or any in the last 15 years, with AI that will so blindly try to drive through another car. There are also wonderful details, present since FM4 at least, like the AI's response to another car being right on its tail through a corner is to brake; you can see from replays that AI cars that aren't being tailed brake less mid-corner. It's almost as though the AI dev team are deliberately trolling us at times.

I'm optimistic that the planned AI revamp will improve things; it's the first time I can recall that there's been any admission that there's an AI problem. Some things would seem relatively easy logic problems (eg hold position on track when contact at the side is detected instead of pushing for preferred line) but the real test is going to be whether they can get drivatars to take corners without needing to stop for directions part way around.
Rank: Racing Permit
 2 users liked this post.
#10 Posted : Saturday, November 10, 2018 2:24:34 PM(UTC)
I ran a 10 lap race last night around the full Silverstone with full damage on in the Forza GT class with the AI set to unbeatable. I had Limit Aggression set to off and no rewinds. No assists except for braking line so I didn't bottle it and end up in the shadow realm. I drove the McLaren #60. I started in 14th out of 24 and finished 4th. I had no problems with the AI being aware of where I was. At most there was a little disagreement with the 4th place Viper where we had a little light contact on lap 8 but that was due more to my fault and diminishing tire grip than the AI. I backed off like I would in an online race, but the Viper was also having grip issues and eventually lost it on the next turn giving me 4th. 1st through 3rd were long gone. At least the AI doesn't brake check in the middle of a straight like they did in F2 - F5. Bump drafting in Forza is simply asking for trouble.... even in MP.
Rank: Driver's License
#11 Posted : Saturday, November 10, 2018 3:45:44 PM(UTC)
The AI should be pretty good. I can't tell if it rubber-bands at all. It probably doesn't. Even the older Forza titles had great AI.
Rank: B-Class Racing License
#12 Posted : Sunday, November 11, 2018 6:21:19 AM(UTC)
In the november edition of the Forza Monthly show, Chris Esaki stated that work is being done on the A.I. Will take time but the goal is to make the "Unbeatable A.I" basically as quick as top level Forza RC players, which would be great. Of course that doesn't adress their overall awareness and behaviour but that should fix their odd tendencies to brake in the middle of corners...

Rank: Driver's License
#13 Posted : Sunday, November 11, 2018 8:09:54 AM(UTC)
Originally Posted by: Khaddar Go to Quoted Post
There are also wonderful details, present since FM4 at least, like the AI's response to another car being right on its tail through a corner is to brake; you can see from replays that AI cars that aren't being tailed brake less mid-corner. It's almost as though the AI dev team are deliberately trolling us at times.


One of the T10 guys (and no, I can't remember who it was or where it was said) has stated that they consider deliberate contact to be part of "close racing", so I expect we're pretty much stuck with Chick Hicks forever.

Originally Posted by: Khaddar Go to Quoted Post
...the real test is going to be whether they can get drivatars to take corners without needing to stop for directions part way around.


That's my hope, as well. If they can get the AI to actually turn in a fast lap (without resorting to grip and power multiplier shenanigans), it'd go a long way towards mitigating the "close racing" that happens in every braking zone.
Rank: A-Class Racing License
#14 Posted : Sunday, November 11, 2018 11:32:44 AM(UTC)
Originally Posted by: Mr Pinstripes Go to Quoted Post
One of the T10 guys (and no, I can't remember who it was or where it was said) has stated that they consider deliberate contact to be part of "close racing", so I expect we're pretty much stuck with Chick Hicks forever.


I really hope you've misunderstood or misremembered that. If T10 genuinely have the idea that "close racing" is behaviour that would get you black flagged at every event I've ever been to then I'd need to rethink my idea that they're serious car guys with good intentions.

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