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#1 Posted : Wednesday, September 5, 2018 9:55:40 AM(UTC)
What is the consensus on these apps for FM7? I'd like to choose one. It seems QuickTune is not track specific which doesn't bother me in fact that is less of a hassle but it does offer that auto aero. ForzaTune has the drift mode setting (I think rain, drift, and drag) so you get those tunes but there is also this that I can refer to. The QuickTune creator says that his tunes are balanced for multiple scenarios but there are no drift tune options and he doesn't plan on implementing them.

I'd also like to use this with FH3. I'd think it wouldn't be a problem. I know these are considered base tunes but I am a beginner with the tuning and need assistance. Also know about online tools like this.
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#2 Posted : Wednesday, September 5, 2018 12:53:04 PM(UTC)
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#3 Posted : Wednesday, September 5, 2018 1:14:15 PM(UTC)
Quick tune FTW.
Forza tune asks for inputs which are dependant on the tune. Makes no sense .

Edited by user Wednesday, September 5, 2018 1:16:20 PM(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

Rank: A-Class Racing License
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#4 Posted : Wednesday, September 5, 2018 7:12:05 PM(UTC)
The standard ForzaTune 7 calculation gives you a car that understeers on entry and oversteers on exit. These traits work well for FWD hatchbacks and mid-engined sportcars, but not for front-engined RWD cars, at least when it comes to my own driving style. So it's not a be-all, end-it-all solution, as it requires some tinkering to become acceptable.

The advertised unique tunes in ForzaTune 7 for each track usually change very little, it's mostly ride height and small spring adjustments. I have also found out that the "tailor-made tunes" for each car don't seem as "tailor-made" as I thought, since cars with similar mass and weight distribution will still have very similar calculated tunes, as if you were using a generic calculator.

QuickTune has resulted in driveable cars but I stopped using it after realizing the car rolls way too much on default settings, which means the sway bars and possibly the springs/dampers are way too soft.

Among free tools, I'd go with the FACR calculator. BG55 usually results in a stiffer car than desirable, though it's been much improved for FM7. FACR however can be customized and used to fix generic traits in a car such as oversteer/understeer, whereas BG55 only lets you play with stiffness.

Edited by user Wednesday, September 5, 2018 7:14:35 PM(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

R.I.P. 24 Heures du Mans

26/05/1923 - 17/06/2018
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#5 Posted : Wednesday, September 5, 2018 8:04:27 PM(UTC)
Quote:
The standard ForzaTune 7 calculation gives you a car that understeers on entry and oversteers on exit.


There is a screen on the Google Play page that shows simple settings for turn entry balance and turn exit balance with a slider for more or less oversteer in FT7?

Thanks for the other recommendations. I will try them. I just wanted something quick and easy to use on the phone. I know cars but not enough to get the in-depth tuning stuff. This user wrote a decent guide here (third link): https://forums.forzamoto...EB-APP---Available.aspx

LOL@ the FACR YT tuning instruction video linked from their page. It's almost three hours. There is also a shorter one. That Tuning In A Nutshell section on FACR is nice. BG55 looks easier to use.

Quote:
Quick tune FTW.
Forza tune asks for inputs which are dependant on the tune. Makes no sense .


Can you give an example?

Edited by user Thursday, October 4, 2018 8:46:17 PM(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

Rank: A-Class Racing License
#6 Posted : Wednesday, September 5, 2018 8:30:35 PM(UTC)
I usually have good results with BG55's calculator. I'll have to give FACR a shot, though - it looks like it offers potentially better adjustment options.
Welcome to the Hyperbolic Whine Chamber. If you cry hard enough you might get your pouter level over 9000.
Rank: A-Class Racing License
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#7 Posted : Wednesday, September 5, 2018 11:00:53 PM(UTC)
Originally Posted by: ConfusedGalaxy6 Go to Quoted Post
Quote:
The standard ForzaTune 7 calculation gives you a car that understeers on entry and oversteers on exit.


But there is a screen on the Google Play page that shows simple settings for turn entry balance and turn exit balance with a slider for more or less oversteer?

Thanks for the other recommendations. I will try them. I just wanted something quick and easy to use on the phone. I know cars but not enough to get the in-depth tuning stuff. This user wrote a decent guide here (third link): https://forums.forzamoto...EB-APP---Available.aspx

LOL@ the FACR YT tuning instruction video linked from their page. It's almost three hours. There is also a shorter one. That Tuning In A Nutshell section on FACR is nice. BG55 looks easier to use.

Quote:
Quick tune FTW.
Forza tune asks for inputs which are dependant on the tune. Makes no sense .


Can you give an example?

People on reddit seem to prefer ForzaTune. I like those sliders in the screenshots for managing oversteer/understeer.


Turn Entry and Turn Exit sliders do small adjustments to differential and dampers. Oversteer/understeer balance changes sway bars, springs and sometimes dampers. The sliders are indeed useful but they also completely defeat the point of having a calculator in the first place, which is to "set and forget". Besides, to use them effectively you must know a thing or two about car behavior and Forza physics. At the very least you must know that softer front creates oversteer and softer rear creates understeer.

Nevertheless, I've found that the app's slider settings you feel comfortable with for one car will apply to others with the same configuration, which is in line with the findings of seasoned tuners, who usually transplant tuning sliders in the game from one car to another with good results.

The FACR method requires a bit more involvement, because the calculator is really only the start. They don't give you ride height, tire pressure, camber, toe nor differential, though they do lead you in the right direction. You'll end up a better tuner with it, but if you lack the time then the other calculators are alright to use.

Of course, no calculator I've used for any Forza game was able to make all of my cars drive as I wanted them to. There was always one that would require further tuning. And obviously the build is the main thing that makes you faster. Tire width setup front/rear can drastically affect the behavior of a car and, if built wrong, the calculator won't be able to fix it effectively.
R.I.P. 24 Heures du Mans

26/05/1923 - 17/06/2018
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#8 Posted : Thursday, September 6, 2018 2:21:23 AM(UTC)
I'm tuning all my cars with the FACR-calculator. Once you become handy with it it really shines in adjusting over/understeer problems. You have to keep in mind though the base results are just the start and many variables are for you to set (tire pressure, ride height, diff). But with a little involvement it gave me the best results by far and since I'm always in the top 1% with the cars, they can't be that bad.
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#9 Posted : Thursday, September 6, 2018 6:08:55 AM(UTC)
"The standard ForzaTune 7 calculation gives you a car that understeers on entry and oversteers on exit.."


- Simply because they are too stiff. Take a ride in the old Porsche Spyder (stock) on a twisty track and compare
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#10 Posted : Thursday, September 6, 2018 12:33:57 PM(UTC)
Originally Posted by: Fairlane306 Go to Quoted Post
"The standard ForzaTune 7 calculation gives you a car that understeers on entry and oversteers on exit.."


- Simply because they are too stiff. Take a ride in the old Porsche Spyder (stock) on a twisty track and compare


Hmmm, you may have a point. Cars tuned with ForzaTune usually have problems navigating the Corkscrew at Laguna Seca. They really feel the bumps there.

However, ForzaTune does soften the cars a fair bit.
R.I.P. 24 Heures du Mans

26/05/1923 - 17/06/2018
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#11 Posted : Thursday, September 6, 2018 1:17:07 PM(UTC)
NEITHER! I hit stock parts, load up my parts and tune it myself. Thats the only really way you'll know the feel of YOUR cars. Tune it yourself with the parts YOU want. Adjustments can always be made to squeeze out more power or a little better handling
Forza junkie since FM2. Horizons are the break I need from the track
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#12 Posted : Thursday, September 6, 2018 1:48:36 PM(UTC)
Forza tune asks for inputs which are dependant on the tune. Makes no sense .[/quote wrote:


Can you give an example?

People on reddit seem to prefer ForzaTune. I like those sliders in the screenshots for managing oversteer/understeer.


I don't recall exactly and since I returned the app for refund I can't check but from what I can remember you need to input acceleration and/or top speed figures before you get the tune. It didn't make sense to me.
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#13 Posted : Thursday, September 6, 2018 11:46:19 PM(UTC)
Thanks everyone for your helpful replies.
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#14 Posted : Friday, September 7, 2018 11:20:34 AM(UTC)
Thanks for looking into ForzaTune. I'm happy to send you a free download code for ForzaTune 7 so you can post your own follow up/review. You can contact me here.

Bart's talking about the gearing calculator, which uses the initial values for top speed and acceleration to "kickstart" the search for an optimal value. For more in-depth information or to get the most out of the tunes I highly recommend this list of short tutorial videos.

Anthony
Helping people tune since 2009.
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#15 Posted : Saturday, September 8, 2018 9:50:50 AM(UTC)
Originally Posted by: NightDriver7800 Go to Quoted Post
QuickTune has resulted in driveable cars but I stopped using it after realizing the car rolls way too much on default settings, which means the sway bars and possibly the springs/dampers are way too soft

Can you provide a specific example where you feel the car is too soft when using QuickTune 7?

Over the course of the last months I participated in Hard Luck Racing’s Hot Lap Challenges and my QuickTune 7 tunes got several #1s across various divisions and track combos beating out or being as fast as tunes from capable tuners, so QuickTune must be doing something right

Have a look in this thread for proof, starting at pg 151 a guy named TridentCoyote (PTG Greeksniper) tested out various tunes with my QuickTune tunes being among the fastest. All my tunes are straight out of QuickTune with no adjustments whatsoever.

Edited by user Saturday, September 8, 2018 10:26:39 AM(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

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#16 Posted : Saturday, September 8, 2018 10:33:28 AM(UTC)
I've used both and either is better than default. I prefer QuickTune as it needs less tweaking for my driving style if any at all. The less assist the faster you will go with the tunes as well. Happy racing!
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#17 Posted : Saturday, September 8, 2018 6:09:37 PM(UTC)
Originally Posted by: fifty inch Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: NightDriver7800 Go to Quoted Post
QuickTune has resulted in driveable cars but I stopped using it after realizing the car rolls way too much on default settings, which means the sway bars and possibly the springs/dampers are way too soft

Can you provide a specific example where you feel the car is too soft when using QuickTune 7?

Over the course of the last months I participated in Hard Luck Racing’s Hot Lap Challenges and my QuickTune 7 tunes got several #1s across various divisions and track combos beating out or being as fast as tunes from capable tuners, so QuickTune must be doing something right

Have a look in this thread for proof, starting at pg 151 a guy named TridentCoyote (PTG Greeksniper) tested out various tunes with my QuickTune tunes being among the fastest. All my tunes are straight out of QuickTune with no adjustments whatsoever.


I must say I don't recall any specific cars, what happened was that in situations where the car would roll a lot, I heard that bumping noise and saw that your tunes are very precise, you work with as much as the car is able to give. I should probably have trusted my feel rather than the noises the car made. Back then I misinterpreted the noises as bottoming out, but this is almost never the case, you really have to either look at the telemetry or pay attention to the car's behavior to notice when the car is bottoming out.

I think I'll give QuickTune a try again. The feature I like the most is the ability to match upgrades to the tune. ForzaTune for example does not do that, if you use chassis upgrade for example you're in a blind spot.

EDIT: I must retract my previous statement. Your app is THAT good. It handles 99% of whatever you throw at it, and the rest can be fixed easily. It speaks volumes for QuickTune when it can tame the most difficult cars in the game without further tuning. I guess the OP's question now has an answer.

Edited by user Saturday, September 8, 2018 9:01:07 PM(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

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26/05/1923 - 17/06/2018
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#18 Posted : Saturday, September 8, 2018 9:42:33 PM(UTC)
@NightDriver: Thank you for your updated review - much appreciated!

QuickTune will get even better once the transmission tuning feature is available which I’m currently working on.

Edited by user Saturday, September 8, 2018 10:21:45 PM(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

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#19 Posted : Sunday, September 9, 2018 3:37:06 AM(UTC)
Given that I don't have anywhere near as much time to play Forza as I used to, I have to say Quick Tune does an excellent job on most cars. I still have to tweek them a bit but that's probably my issue rather than trusting the values it puts out.

Haven't tried Forza Tune so I can't give an opinion but the fact that we have so many options to help with tuning nowadays is a testament to this community and I think this should be celebrated as I don't think alot of people fully appreciate how much work goes into these things.

So thank you to the developers of these apps and calculators, it is hugely appreciated!
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#20 Posted : Sunday, September 9, 2018 7:26:49 AM(UTC)
Originally Posted by: TRG wacky gt Go to Quoted Post
Given that I don't have anywhere near as much time to play Forza as I used to, I have to say Quick Tune does an excellent job on most cars. I still have to tweek them a bit but that's probably my issue rather than trusting the values it puts out.

Haven't tried Forza Tune so I can't give an opinion but the fact that we have so many options to help with tuning nowadays is a testament to this community and I think this should be celebrated as I don't think alot of people fully appreciate how much work goes into these things.

So thank you to the developers of these apps and calculators, it is hugely appreciated!


I 2nd this!

Thanks to the community for helping with quick to super in depth tuning methods and tutorials. The diversity is great for those who have plenty of time and those who don't and want to just be competitive in multiplayer without downloading tunes. I like to do that to, but the calculators help teach me what each adjustment does on the track.
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#21 Posted : Sunday, September 9, 2018 8:56:29 AM(UTC)
Originally Posted by: Djaj88 Go to Quoted Post
The Basement Garage
I use their site for some very decent tunes. Takes 5 minutes to punch in all the information and you have to adjust the downforce and ride hight yourself.

Edited by user Sunday, September 9, 2018 8:58:10 AM(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

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#22 Posted : Sunday, September 9, 2018 10:35:57 AM(UTC)
@theSNaiL46 You're welcome! I'm happy to extend the offer for free download codes to you or anyone on this thread (up to 30). Contact me via the ForzaTune site or just let me know here. I'd hate people to miss out if they are on the fence.

There are many good options now but ForzaTune 7 spares no expense -- 9 years of work went into it. You get tunes tailored to car, track, dry, drift, or rain. And it has a gearing calculator built in, easy customizations, metric units, saving and searching tunes, detailed tutorials, etc.

I usually just plug the numbers in and go, but it's nice to know you have everything you need at your disposal.

Fifty Inch is a great guy too and will likely be the successor as "tuning app guy" when I retire someday.
Helping people tune since 2009.
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#23 Posted : Sunday, September 9, 2018 1:03:06 PM(UTC)
Originally Posted by: Boosted4Ever Go to Quoted Post

Fifty Inch is a great guy too and will likely be the successor as "tuning app guy" when I retire someday.

Anthony thank you I feel humbled by your kind words. But I do think it’s far too early for retirement for you :-)

Let’s keep pushing the tuning apps further. I hope Forza franchise will keep running for some years.

Edited by user Sunday, September 9, 2018 1:04:34 PM(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

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#24 Posted : Sunday, September 9, 2018 5:57:37 PM(UTC)
Originally Posted by: fifty inch Go to Quoted Post
Let’s keep pushing the tuning apps further. I hope Forza franchise will keep running for some years.


Absolutely! And I appreciate the friendly competition. Makes both apps better over time.
Helping people tune since 2009.
Rank: Racing Permit
#25 Posted : Thursday, September 13, 2018 1:39:09 PM(UTC)
My challenge to the app developers is to try and incorporate the idea of resonant frequency into the app instead of relying on an overall stiffness setting. There will of course be differences between the real world and Forza, but clearly cars in a division like Forza GT tends to work best if set up very firm and highly damped whereas cars in lesser divisions probably do better with softer settings. The racecar setup literature talks about GT cars with aero having resonant frequencies (determined by spring and damper rates) of 3-5 Hz, and street cars having 1.5 - 2 Hz or so.

I tried to figure this out from the literature but the game fails to disclose motion ratios or damper units so this wasn't something that could be pursued - until now. With the Data Out feature we can now pull a 60Hz datastream out the game and use it to analyze effect of settings on car performance. As a player and amateur coder I don't have the time or business need to get into tuning via data out analysis for more than a handful of cars, but that is certainly something that you might want to consider for your next versions of your apps.

Hope this gives you food for thought towards development of algorithms for setting stiffness and damping tailored to the division of car.

Edited by user Thursday, September 13, 2018 1:39:59 PM(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

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