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Rank: C-Class Racing License
#626 Posted : Tuesday, March 6, 2018 4:00:51 PM(UTC)
Homologation, I find isn't the issue. The real issue in my opinion is being thrown into a lobby with people better, faster or slower than myself. There will always be faster and slower than yourself. Play single player, test drive tune and race ghost or not to earn credits. The only thing you'll be missing out on is some multiplayer achievements that you can get later. Implementing driver divisions into the game would fix a lot of the issues. The homologated leader board times proves that you can be fast. I'm getting faster everyday just by playing the game. I just need to work on getting consistent lap times. Drive Clean.

Edited by user Tuesday, March 6, 2018 4:07:19 PM(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

Rank: A-Class Racing License
 1 user liked this post.
#627 Posted : Tuesday, March 6, 2018 4:07:40 PM(UTC)
Originally Posted by: xJonxMonx56 Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: Lucas JSR Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: Stang616 Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: Power strocker Go to Quoted Post
But when I select "NO" to accept upgrades, it automatically undoes my choice of car division.
That's just what I do not want.


It didn't used to, I think that is another bug that was introduced. I noticed it as well.


Really? I've noticed this too, but I thought it was intentional. Since each division requires a certain configuration, I thought that it wouldn't make much sense to be able to turn off homologation inside a division.


I thought so as well. Most divisions at a minimum require a change of tire compound, which would be considered an upgrade. If you set "Allow Upgrades" to No, then most of the divisions simply won't work, or there would only be a few cars eligible at best. Given that there's also a hidden minimum PI limit, even if the tire compound is correct stock, you'd probably still have to throw something(s) on there to make it eligible.

It does seem to be binary. Entirely homologated, or entirely free. There is no in-between.


The divisions are not strictly related to performance, they group similar cars together. If the opposite was true you'd have been able to homologate every car into every division as long as it met the requirements.

It could be a bug because I don't see how weight and year limits should void the homologation.
R.I.P. 24 Heures du Mans

26/05/1923 - 17/06/2018
Rank: A-Class Racing License
 2 users liked this post.
#628 Posted : Wednesday, March 7, 2018 6:02:16 AM(UTC)
Originally Posted by: NeoDragonaut Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: xJonxMonx56 Go to Quoted Post
I thought so as well. Most divisions at a minimum require a change of tire compound, which would be considered an upgrade. If you set "Allow Upgrades" to No, then most of the divisions simply won't work, or there would only be a few cars eligible at best. Given that there's also a hidden minimum PI limit, even if the tire compound is correct stock, you'd probably still have to throw something(s) on there to make it eligible.

It does seem to be binary. Entirely homologated, or entirely free. There is no in-between.


The divisions are not strictly related to performance, they group similar cars together. If the opposite was true you'd have been able to homologate every car into every division as long as it met the requirements.

It could be a bug because I don't see how weight and year limits should void the homologation.


None of that's false......but didn't really affect anything I said. I'm saying that for many cars in their divisions, they need upgrades to be eligible to race in their own division. If you do not allow upgrades, there's no way that car can run in its division. You have to play within the homologation ruleset (which means allowing upgrades), or you have to make it so anything is allowed, eliminating the whole point of homologation.

Edit: Wait, I think I got what you mean, of course right as I press Post. Just run the cars in that division, forget homologation, upgrades, etc., just simply have all Modern Hot Hatches in a race together, all Modern SUVs, etc.?

In that case, I'll give everyone the benefit of the doubt in saying that it's a bug, as I can't recall personally running a non-upgraded division race in Free Play before it was broken (not by rules, but by personal choice of not wanting to).

In older games, you could manually choose every car in Free Play :/

Edited by user Wednesday, March 7, 2018 6:07:20 AM(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

One of "The 50"
Rank: R-Class Racing License
#629 Posted : Wednesday, March 7, 2018 7:15:20 AM(UTC)
This seems like a reasonable thread in which to ask...

I just tried Freeplay, to run some Spec races. Allow Upgrades = No, set specific car (in this case, the '73 Porsche Carrera), AI set to unbeatable.

AI cars get +10 hp?

So, set hp to <= 207 (I think that was it... doesn't matter if I'm off here).

AI cars still get 217 hp ???

Anybody found a way to actually get Spec races in Freeplay?

.
Mod edit - WSD - max 1 line of text with sig --- Please don't use your sig to attack other forum members - Duey
Rank: A-Class Racing License
#630 Posted : Wednesday, March 7, 2018 10:21:53 AM(UTC)
Originally Posted by: Don Ente Go to Quoted Post
This seems like a reasonable thread in which to ask...

I just tried Freeplay, to run some Spec races. Allow Upgrades = No, set specific car (in this case, the '73 Porsche Carrera), AI set to unbeatable.

AI cars get +10 hp?

So, set hp to <= 207 (I think that was it... doesn't matter if I'm off here).

AI cars still get 217 hp ???

Anybody found a way to actually get Spec races in Freeplay?

.


Try switching off Unbeatable.

AFAIK the added difficulty Unbeatable provides over Pro is extra power regardless of homologation requirement, as mentioned by some people having Unbeatable Major Micros races with AI having 82hp cars (division limit is 75hp). This lets the AI perform exceptionally (read: notoriously) well on long straights and long straight dominant tracks like Sebring.

If Pro gives 207hp, you're all set. If it's still showing 217hp, beats me.
One of "The 50"
Rank: R-Class Racing License
#631 Posted : Wednesday, March 7, 2018 10:47:34 AM(UTC)
Originally Posted by: xJonxMonx56 Go to Quoted Post
Try switching off Unbeatable.

So, is the general consensus that Unbeatable vs Pro simply upgrades the AI's cars (even past the restrictions)? As opposed to "giving them more skill"?

.
Mod edit - WSD - max 1 line of text with sig --- Please don't use your sig to attack other forum members - Duey
Rank: Moderator
#632 Posted : Wednesday, March 7, 2018 10:56:20 AM(UTC)
I haven't tested it myself but I get the same sense from reading other comments that JonxMonx posted. You could try experimenting with power handicaps on buckets with unbeatable drivatars to see if they're immune to that setting or not.
Rank: A-Class Racing License
#633 Posted : Wednesday, March 7, 2018 2:06:58 PM(UTC)
Originally Posted by: Don Ente Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: xJonxMonx56 Go to Quoted Post
Try switching off Unbeatable.

So, is the general consensus that Unbeatable vs Pro simply upgrades the AI's cars (even past the restrictions)? As opposed to "giving them more skill"?

.


They're usually more aggressive as well.
R.I.P. 24 Heures du Mans

26/05/1923 - 17/06/2018
Rank: Racing Permit
#634 Posted : Wednesday, March 7, 2018 2:18:38 PM(UTC)
Originally Posted by: xJonxMonx56 Go to Quoted Post


Edit: Wait, I think I got what you mean, of course right as I press Post. Just run the cars in that division, forget homologation, upgrades, etc., just simply have all Modern Hot Hatches in a race together, all Modern SUVs, etc.?

In that case, I'll give everyone the benefit of the doubt in saying that it's a bug, as I can't recall personally running a non-upgraded division race in Free Play before it was broken (not by rules, but by personal choice of not wanting to).

In older games, you could manually choose every car in Free Play :/


Yeah, now I got what other people mean as well, they simply want to race with the cars in a given division regardless of upgrades, that would be very cool indeed. I could finally make a Forza P1 division race with stock P1 cars, but without annoying F1 cars showing up in the race, LOL

Also, to be able to manually chose every car in the race would be awesome, I wonder why they removed this feature in FM7.

Rank: S-Class Racing License
#635 Posted : Thursday, March 8, 2018 1:00:50 PM(UTC)
Just got well and truly owned by Homologation in career.

Started a masters event, bought a car that the game suggested. Immediately it asks me to homologate the car as the game doesn't think it's competitive. It then tells me the car is already optimised for the event. So I have a car suggested for the event that I can't use because it just bounces you around homologation popup.

Great. Thanks Turn10.
Rank: A-Class Racing License
#636 Posted : Thursday, March 8, 2018 1:25:24 PM(UTC)
Originally Posted by: mohegan13 Go to Quoted Post
Just got well and truly owned by Homologation in career.

Started a masters event, bought a car that the game suggested. Immediately it asks me to homologate the car as the game doesn't think it's competitive. It then tells me the car is already optimised for the event. So I have a car suggested for the event that I can't use because it just bounces you around homologation popup.

Great. Thanks Turn10.


You need to build the car, best way to start is buying all the adjustable parts and tire width according to how much power you have (or max it out anyway).

If the transmission is junk buy the Race one.

Weight depends on what you want, some people lower it to the max for handling, but if you want more top end you need power instead.

The build part is more important than ever, although some cars only have one possible build for their division.

Buy it stock then add the parts, it's not too difficult.
R.I.P. 24 Heures du Mans

26/05/1923 - 17/06/2018
Rank: S-Class Racing License
#637 Posted : Thursday, March 8, 2018 2:52:49 PM(UTC)
Originally Posted by: Don Ente Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: xJonxMonx56 Go to Quoted Post
Try switching off Unbeatable.

So, is the general consensus that Unbeatable vs Pro simply upgrades the AI's cars (even past the restrictions)? As opposed to "giving them more skill"?

.


Yep, and I think it's been proven in the past few months through people sharing telemetry info on AI cars, where drivatars on Unbeatable gain a few extra hp.
Rank: S-Class Racing License
#638 Posted : Friday, March 9, 2018 1:07:23 AM(UTC)
Originally Posted by: NeoDragonaut Go to Quoted Post

You need to build the car, best way to start is buying all the adjustable parts and tire width according to how much power you have (or max it out anyway).


Okay so a new day and some coffee and I figured out what it was. I missed the tyre width. They are the only two upgrades the game included when I bought the Opel and it was that which was apparently pushing my 1 PI over the allowed restrictions. Not sure why the game can't figure out removing one or both of those upgrades is all that was needed. But hey at least I know why it was happening and can race with the car. :)
Rank: C-Class Racing License
 1 user liked this post.
#639 Posted : Friday, March 9, 2018 9:19:20 AM(UTC)
Originally Posted by: LAZARUSceelai Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: Don Ente Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: xJonxMonx56 Go to Quoted Post
Try switching off Unbeatable.

So, is the general consensus that Unbeatable vs Pro simply upgrades the AI's cars (even past the restrictions)? As opposed to "giving them more skill"?

.


Yep, and I think it's been proven in the past few months through people sharing telemetry info on AI cars, where drivatars on Unbeatable gain a few extra hp.


Even on unbeatable, the AI are woefully slow in the corners. As an example, last night I was racing Sport Coupes on Nürburgring Full (5 laps) with the 2011 BMW Z4. My tune has 358 HP - well below the 550 limit. The Jaguar F-Type which was running up front had well over 600 HP. Since Nürburgring Full is mostly a speed-based track, you would expect the Jag to absolutely dominate the BMW, which it did... until turn 1. At the finish, my BMW's best lap was a 9:19, where the Jag couldn't break 9:34.

1939 Mercedes-Benz T80 (Cancelled via WWII) - 3000hp 44.5L V12 - 470mph (Projected)
Rank: A-Class Racing License
#640 Posted : Friday, March 9, 2018 12:04:19 PM(UTC)
Originally Posted by: mohegan13 Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: NeoDragonaut Go to Quoted Post

You need to build the car, best way to start is buying all the adjustable parts and tire width according to how much power you have (or max it out anyway).


Okay so a new day and some coffee and I figured out what it was. I missed the tyre width. They are the only two upgrades the game included when I bought the Opel and it was that which was apparently pushing my 1 PI over the allowed restrictions. Not sure why the game can't figure out removing one or both of those upgrades is all that was needed. But hey at least I know why it was happening and can race with the car. :)


That auto homologation will only work to bring the car up to spec not to detune it to meet requirements.
R.I.P. 24 Heures du Mans

26/05/1923 - 17/06/2018
Rank: D-Class Racing License
#641 Posted : Thursday, March 15, 2018 1:17:38 PM(UTC)
The E49 Charger is in the wrong class. It should be under Historic Road Racing alongside the XY GTHO. Both cars raced in the same category (Class D) at Bathurst in 1972 so they should be in the same class in FM7.

Edited by user Thursday, March 15, 2018 1:22:41 PM(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

Rank: A-Class Racing License
#642 Posted : Thursday, March 15, 2018 1:51:24 PM(UTC)
Originally Posted by: holden4ever Go to Quoted Post
The E49 Charger is in the wrong class. It should be under Historic Road Racing alongside the XY GTHO. Both cars raced in the same category (Class D) at Bathurst in 1972 so they should be in the same class in FM7.


Both Monaros are in Classic Street Muscle but this does not mean anything. The only actual difference between these divisions is tire width and slightly higher PI limit.

I'd have put all the compacts under HRR and the midsizes under CSM (you'll notice the Dodge Charger is under HRR while the Chevelle and friends are in CSM) but for some reason it was not meant to be.
R.I.P. 24 Heures du Mans

26/05/1923 - 17/06/2018
Rank: Racing Permit
 2 users liked this post.
#643 Posted : Friday, March 16, 2018 6:47:46 AM(UTC)

Hello guys!

I want to give a personal suggestion of Turn10 in FREE GAME mode:

- Create championships (up to 5 races)

- Choose the number of cars (up to 23)
- Choose the cars (without any restriction or homologation)
- Choose the tracks (any track day, night with or without rain)
- Same way of scoring the Drivers Cup)

It would be really cool if we had this game mode in FREE GAME!

Who liked the idea, leave a like or comment!

A hug!
Rank: D-Class Racing License
#644 Posted : Sunday, March 18, 2018 9:25:11 PM(UTC)
Originally Posted by: NeoDragonaut Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: holden4ever Go to Quoted Post
The E49 Charger is in the wrong class. It should be under Historic Road Racing alongside the XY GTHO. Both cars raced in the same category (Class D) at Bathurst in 1972 so they should be in the same class in FM7.


Both Monaros are in Classic Street Muscle but this does not mean anything. The only actual difference between these divisions is tire width and slightly higher PI limit.

I'd have put all the compacts under HRR and the midsizes under CSM (you'll notice the Dodge Charger is under HRR while the Chevelle and friends are in CSM) but for some reason it was not meant to be.



They still should be in the same class. Same with (if they ever add it) the 1972 Holden LJ Torana XU-1. The XU-1 was in a lower class but beat the GTHO and E49 that year. They are rivals and should be grouped together so we can have that rivalry in races. This wouldn't be a problem if we still had A,B,C etc but with Homologation it takes away the opportunity to recreate these classic battles. I like Homologation but T10 need to take into account the actual history of these cars and what they were up against instead of adding them where they think they should go.
Rank: Driver's Permit
#645 Posted : Tuesday, March 27, 2018 6:25:52 PM(UTC)
The P1 GTR should be in the Forza Gt division because:
1. It looks like a GT car.
2. Its made for racing.

Rank: D-Class Racing License
 3 users liked this post.
#646 Posted : Wednesday, March 28, 2018 5:34:53 AM(UTC)
Originally Posted by: asiangamer534 Go to Quoted Post
The P1 GTR should be in the Forza Gt division because:
1. It looks like a GT car.
2. Its made for racing.



Just because it looks like a GT car does not mean it should be grouped with the GT cars. The P1 GTR has Twice as much HP as some of the GT cars. It should be grouped in a separate division for Extreme Track Cars including things like the FXXK, AM Vulcan, and other not-road-legal extreme editions of hypercars.
Rank: Driver's License
#647 Posted : Thursday, March 29, 2018 1:11:17 AM(UTC)
I've just got the game and have only just started racing.

I used the Golf in the first series which was fine.

I then bought an Evo VI and found there were homologation restrictions straight away. I had about 3 PI points to play with before it exceeds the homogolation limits.

I thought the homogolation would only be for specific series or events, not an overall restriction for modifying the cars. Does this mean that if I exceed the limits I will be unable to race it in any career events? Unless the Evo is basically stock, I will be unable to tune it because adding any race parts will exceed homologation limits.

Sorry if the question has already been answered, first real Forza game I have owned since 4 and trying to get my head around it.
Rank: D-Class Racing License
#648 Posted : Thursday, March 29, 2018 7:10:17 AM(UTC)
Originally Posted by: Tonystarks11311 Go to Quoted Post
I then bought an Evo VI and found there were homologation restrictions straight away. I had about 3 PI points to play with before it exceeds the homogolation limits.

By default the cars come pre-upgraded to meet homologation specs, Remove the pre-installed parts or chose the "Buy with Stock Parts Installed" option when buying a car. You will have more PI to play with and can often get a much better car upgrading it yourself.

Quote:
I thought the homogolation would only be for specific series or events, not an overall restriction for modifying the cars. Does this mean that if I exceed the limits I will be unable to race it in any career events? Unless the Evo is basically stock,

Homologation is used for all Career mode race series. Freeplay and Open Class hoppers in multiplayer will allow you to tune the cars however you like outside of homologation restrictions.

Quote:
I will be unable to tune it because adding any race parts will exceed homologation limits.

As I said earlier, Remove the pre-installed parts and upgrade it yourself. I have plenty of homologation ready tunes on my cars with race parts installed.

Rank: A-Class Racing License
#649 Posted : Thursday, March 29, 2018 7:35:29 AM(UTC)
Going across some of the divisions I got the idea that in B class and below Turn 10 really wanted us to use Street/Sport suspension and brakes... Because some cars cannot have all adjustable parts added to them no matter what.

And I refuse to add boy racer wing to my M5 E39. :D

The pretuned build never adds aero, nor custom wheels. The reason is obvious: to keep the car looking stock. Further upgrades are at the discretion of the player.

So I started to become somewhat skeptical of how some divisions were handled, because some of these PI limits are simply too low. Rebirth of Muscle is a joke for example, you race those cars mostly stock, but those cars are no fun stock because they're from the lower emissions era and everyone wants to tune them.

The best divisions in the game tend to be those in S class and above, IMO, with the odd division in the lower classes, though the latter will usually have one or two cars you can't add adjustable coilovers and/or brakes to.
R.I.P. 24 Heures du Mans

26/05/1923 - 17/06/2018
Rank: C-Class Racing License
 1 user liked this post.
#650 Posted : Thursday, March 29, 2018 11:16:19 AM(UTC)
Originally Posted by: Shanic Oatmeme Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: asiangamer534 Go to Quoted Post
The P1 GTR should be in the Forza Gt division because:
1. It looks like a GT car.
2. Its made for racing.



Just because it looks like a GT car does not mean it should be grouped with the GT cars. The P1 GTR has Twice as much HP as some of the GT cars. It should be grouped in a separate division for Extreme Track Cars including things like the FXXK, AM Vulcan, and other not-road-legal extreme editions of hypercars.


Exactly. It bugs me to see a veyron, agera, laferrari, Zonda Cinque etc racing with the p1 gtr, fxx K, and one:1. Maybe they will finally get right for Forza 8... There just needs to be that separate division for purpose built track cars.
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