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Rank: Driver's Permit
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#1 Posted : Friday, July 28, 2017 11:50:11 AM(UTC)
Does anyone else feel like the Forza Motorsport games are more like overtaking simulators than racing simulators?

I believe so and the simple reason is, no qualifying. Without qualifying it makes it impossible to have the competition set to your standard. Every race you have to start mid to rear of the pack and, if you have the difficulty set so that drivatars are comparable in speed to you, you'll finish mid to rear of the pack.

The only way to prevent finishing mid pack is to set your opponents so they're fairly easily catchable (otherwise progressing from 16th to 1st place would be impossible).

At least with the option to qualify, you could have the difficulty set so you're able to qualify well inside the top 10. This would make a podium finish difficult but achievable (which is how I like my racing games), without having to bully and force your way past cars that you have been forced to set as slower than you.

Please, Turn 10, add qualifying to your game so we can do more racing and less overtaking.

Edited by user Friday, July 28, 2017 5:42:29 PM(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

Rank: S-Class Racing License
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#2 Posted : Friday, July 28, 2017 12:19:00 PM(UTC)
more like an obstacle course with a mix of bad drivers crashing everywhere and wreckers to get around in a hopper
Rank: S-Class Racing License
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#3 Posted : Saturday, July 29, 2017 3:08:26 AM(UTC)
Originally Posted by: ApexWolf5 Go to Quoted Post
Does anyone else feel like the Forza Motorsport games are more like overtaking simulators than racing simulators?

I believe so and the simple reason is, no qualifying. Without qualifying it makes it impossible to have the competition set to your standard. Every race you have to start mid to rear of the pack and, if you have the difficulty set so that drivatars are comparable in speed to you, you'll finish mid to rear of the pack.

The only way to prevent finishing mid pack is to set your opponents so they're fairly easily catchable (otherwise progressing from 16th to 1st place would be impossible).

At least with the option to qualify, you could have the difficulty set so you're able to qualify well inside the top 10. This would make a podium finish difficult but achievable (which is how I like my racing games), without having to bully and force your way past cars that you have been forced to set as slower than you.

Please, Turn 10, add qualifying to your game so we can do more racing and less overtaking.
You answered your own question, in a way. Forza Motorsport is not a racing simulator. It is a car GAME. They have never been meant to be a Simulator, and I hope they never get that way. If you want a Racing Simulator you will need to look elsewhere, like Project Cars or Asseto Corsa.
And the Talby goes to,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,Whoever thought up the Story Mode
Rank: A-Class Racing License
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#4 Posted : Monday, July 31, 2017 10:47:57 PM(UTC)
There's two ways of looking at this. Sure, if there was qualifying you'd likely start every race on pole, run a few uncontested hot laps and finish first. That's easily as bad if not worse than starting towards the back and having to barge through the pack.

The problem is having to podium every race. This is where it becomes unrealistic and this could easily be avoided with a "championship" points system rather than a string of one off races. We'll have to see how they do things in 7.
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#5 Posted : Tuesday, August 8, 2017 4:17:30 AM(UTC)
Originally Posted by: latotheX Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: ApexWolf5 Go to Quoted Post
Does anyone else feel like the Forza Motorsport games are more like overtaking simulators than racing simulators?

I believe so and the simple reason is, no qualifying. Without qualifying it makes it impossible to have the competition set to your standard. Every race you have to start mid to rear of the pack and, if you have the difficulty set so that drivatars are comparable in speed to you, you'll finish mid to rear of the pack.

The only way to prevent finishing mid pack is to set your opponents so they're fairly easily catchable (otherwise progressing from 16th to 1st place would be impossible).

At least with the option to qualify, you could have the difficulty set so you're able to qualify well inside the top 10. This would make a podium finish difficult but achievable (which is how I like my racing games), without having to bully and force your way past cars that you have been forced to set as slower than you.

Please, Turn 10, add qualifying to your game so we can do more racing and less overtaking.
You answered your own question, in a way. Forza Motorsport is not a racing simulator. It is a car GAME. They have never been meant to be a Simulator, and I hope they never get that way. If you want a Racing Simulator you will need to look elsewhere, like Project Cars or Asseto Corsa.


I think that's a pretty weak excuse for leaving out a basic element of all types of racing. Turn 10 is holding all these racing competitions, so they obviously want "real" racing to be a core aspect of the game at some level. Starting at the back of a field with three whole laps to get to the front is neither real racing nor particularly fun after a few races. The lack of this option makes online league racing much more complicated, too.
Rank: C-Class Racing License
#6 Posted : Tuesday, August 8, 2017 7:17:30 AM(UTC)
The career mode is really limited.
Try to enjoy the other parts of the game. Career is really something simple and we can't do anything. Maybe they think that changing to a more real tournament people will start to think they are copying other games?
Or is it just tailored for kids/casual play?

By the way, what good career modes are out there anyway? F1 games of course because they have the real life championship and need to be like that. But is there any other game with a satisfying career mode? WRC? (I don't know how the WRC championship is hehe) Project Cars?
Rank: On the Podium
#7 Posted : Tuesday, August 8, 2017 7:44:51 AM(UTC)
There is qualifying to an extent with multiplayer. From what I can tell there are a few ways to accomplish this with players. It all has to be private though with the first race set to ranking players based on lap time.

Not sure why single player lacks an easy to use qualifying functionality.
Rank: S-Class Racing License
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#8 Posted : Wednesday, August 9, 2017 12:34:55 AM(UTC)
Originally Posted by: ApexWolf5 Go to Quoted Post
Does anyone else feel like the Forza Motorsport games are more like overtaking simulators than racing simulators?

I believe so and the simple reason is, no qualifying. Without qualifying it makes it impossible to have the competition set to your standard. Every race you have to start mid to rear of the pack and, if you have the difficulty set so that drivatars are comparable in speed to you, you'll finish mid to rear of the pack.

The only way to prevent finishing mid pack is to set your opponents so they're fairly easily catchable (otherwise progressing from 16th to 1st place would be impossible).

At least with the option to qualify, you could have the difficulty set so you're able to qualify well inside the top 10. This would make a podium finish difficult but achievable (which is how I like my racing games), without having to bully and force your way past cars that you have been forced to set as slower than you.

Please, Turn 10, add qualifying to your game so we can do more racing and less overtaking.


Great point! Adding a qualifying session is as simple as a few lines of code. I don't why they haven't included this in the game. It's pretty much a no-brainer. If you work hard during a qualifying session, you deserve to have your ***. placed higher up on the grid! Simple!
Rank: B-Class Racing License
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#9 Posted : Wednesday, August 9, 2017 4:31:04 AM(UTC)
Qualifying won't work especially for a game like this. You are dealing with the masses and most don't won't to go through each session even if it's a timed session. And having a 5 lap qualifying session won't work either because most players can't cut a clean lap anyways. All the players want to do is get in a lobby or game and race and not deal with all the other sessions. If T10 does add those sessions more players will steer away from the game and play something else, look at PCars, AC, and F1 for example, low users. Now for online or SP if they let the player check the option to add qualifying then that would be a different story, but forcing everyone to qualify for a position would not work as so many variables can happen.
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#10 Posted : Wednesday, August 9, 2017 6:06:28 AM(UTC)
I for one don’t want to have to go through Qualifying for each race. So, please Turn 10, if you do that, make it an option.

However, I WOULD like to see more versatility for AI Drivatar Difficulty. I think the current options are to wide of a gap; for example, with Drivatar Difficulty set at EXPERT, I can usually win. But if I move it to PRO, I usually lose. Instead of using AVERAGE, SKILLED, EXPERT, PRO, UNBEATABLE… why not make it a “slider” bar from 0 to 100 where 0 = a bunch of kindergarteners on Big Wheels, and 100 = Death Race 3000.
Sometimes I wrestle with my demons... sometimes, we just snuggle.
Rank: B-Class Racing License
#11 Posted : Wednesday, August 9, 2017 8:00:39 AM(UTC)
Different difficulties and different sliders are fine but they should try and test adaptive AI and get rid of all of this drive a **** concept. If they want, keep the GTs with the paint schemes of the cars but have have the AI adapt to your driving every race. A few other racing games have done something similar and have had great success. If the players love to crash into others and do other dumb things then the AI will adapt to it and they can have there own fun out of it while the others that want to race, the AI will adapt to there style. When first starting out, the AI should be beatable and every race after that the AI will adapt and make the races more competitive leaving the player with a better experience. But if adaptive AI is something they do not like then have another option with the difficulty or a slider.
Rank: Driver's License
#12 Posted : Wednesday, August 9, 2017 8:15:42 AM(UTC)
^I think FM4 had something like that for the career mode and it kinda worked pretty well. I wouldn't mind it myself but a lot of people prefer to be able to adjust it manually.
Rank: Driver's License
#13 Posted : Wednesday, August 9, 2017 8:53:14 AM(UTC)
Definitely an 'avoid bumper cars' simulator, considering every little bump is recorded into your Drivatar.

I go out of my way not to trade paint, but it's hard to get around the Drivatars from time to time.

Oh, the grief...
Rank: Racing Permit
#14 Posted : Wednesday, August 9, 2017 1:13:06 PM(UTC)
my experience with the game is , if you play career mode , on unbeatable ai , its really hard to come in first , but forza 5 and 6 dont force you to come in first to progress , it doesn't matter as long art you are gold which is 3rd place ..

if you play career mode unbeatable with any car class under r its really hard to win , if the races are under 20 laps , almost impossible , but if you play with r class p and x class , you have a better chance if you use community tunes .

if you free play with 20 plus laps , the ai will wreck usually , you can also cause them to wreck with a rewind lol , but on free play over 20 laps r , p , or x class with tunes you should win every time???

Edited by user Wednesday, August 9, 2017 1:13:43 PM(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

Rank: On the Podium
#15 Posted : Wednesday, August 9, 2017 1:27:07 PM(UTC)
Taking the question literally:

Quote:
Forza Motorsport, more like an overtaking simulator than a racing simulator?


An "overtaking simulator" would teach players the correct way to overtake another car, tangibly reward them for doing so and punish them for failure.

Forza Motorsport does none of those things. The Career mode in Forza Motorsport 6 essentially read as "You start here, you must finish here. We don't care how you do it just get it done.".
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#16 Posted : Thursday, August 10, 2017 11:13:31 PM(UTC)
Originally Posted by: ECT CHEF Go to Quoted Post
Qualifying won't work especially for a game like this. You are dealing with the masses and most don't won't to go through each session even if it's a timed session. And having a 5 lap qualifying session won't work either because most players can't cut a clean lap anyways. All the players want to do is get in a lobby or game and race and not deal with all the other sessions. If T10 does add those sessions more players will steer away from the game and play something else, look at PCars, AC, and F1 for example, low users. Now for online or SP if they let the player check the option to add qualifying then that would be a different story, but forcing everyone to qualify for a position would not work as so many variables can happen.


Well, players can always skip qualifying, can't they and just deal with random placement on the grid. But it should at least be an option. I doubt if there's anyone among the fan base who would resent the idea!
Rank: A-Class Racing License
#17 Posted : Thursday, August 10, 2017 11:16:09 PM(UTC)
Forza Motorsport has always felt like TimeTrials with obstacles, GT feels the same to me. I have never felt like i am racing, and I look forward to seeing if this changes in FM7
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Rank: S-Class Racing License
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#18 Posted : Friday, August 11, 2017 8:43:18 AM(UTC)
Originally Posted by: David McKenna Go to Quoted Post
Forza Motorsport has always felt like TimeTrials with obstacles, GT feels the same to me. I have never felt like i am racing, and I look forward to seeing if this changes in FM7


I highly doubt that - F7 is just an updated version with more tracks and cars, dynamic weather/time of day on select tracks, slightly upgraded visuals and audio (I'm hoping), and perhaps, physics too. That's about it. They haven't mentioned anything about the racing structure, so at this stage, one can only assume. So sadly, no qualifying it seems.
Rank: Driver's Permit
#19 Posted : Wednesday, March 28, 2018 9:19:29 AM(UTC)
Atleast in Forza 3 you had that every 10 levels from 1 to 100 you moved 1 place up on the grid. So with level 1-10 you always started 10th, level 10-20: 9th and so on, till level 100. Where you started 1st from then on.

They really need to bring that back. Atleast then i will buy a Forza Motorsport game again.

Edited by user Wednesday, March 28, 2018 9:21:06 AM(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

Rank: Racing Permit
#20 Posted : Thursday, March 29, 2018 5:32:03 AM(UTC)
Originally Posted by: DCAR Vortex Go to Quoted Post
Atleast in Forza 3 you had that every 10 levels from 1 to 100 you moved 1 place up on the grid. So with level 1-10 you always started 10th, level 10-20: 9th and so on, till level 100. Where you started 1st from then on.

They really need to bring that back. Atleast then i will buy a Forza Motorsport game again.


i belive they do it by lap times now(clean laps are alwys p fornt)
Rank: S-Class Racing License
#21 Posted : Thursday, March 29, 2018 9:37:03 AM(UTC)
Originally Posted by: Smoke Vn Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: DCAR Vortex Go to Quoted Post
Atleast in Forza 3 you had that every 10 levels from 1 to 100 you moved 1 place up on the grid. So with level 1-10 you always started 10th, level 10-20: 9th and so on, till level 100. Where you started 1st from then on.

They really need to bring that back. Atleast then i will buy a Forza Motorsport game again.


i belive they do it by lap times now(clean laps are alwys p fornt)
This happens in Online only though.

And the Talby goes to,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,Whoever thought up the Story Mode

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