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Rank: On the Podium
#76 Posted : Monday, March 27, 2017 5:50:57 PM(UTC)
Tried the tune and there was an adjustment period but did run a 1:26.4 on my 5th lap with room to spare.

The positives were after the transition of adjusting to the car and playing with a few lines the car was predictable if you hit your marks. There wasn't a whole lot of guess work on what the car would do. I'm thinking about signing into another account just to set a time on the track. Should do 25s with better lines.

The negatives were there wasn't much wiggle room in line choice. If you hit it you did great, if you didn't you would most likely understeer off the track or kick the rear end out if going slow enough. I could tell that the balance of the car was shifted to the front. It wasn't shifted to the point that it was plowing, but enough to where I could feel the weight at the front guiding the car. I wasn't always able to wheel the car how I wanted. There was a level of inertia to where the only fix was to adjust my lines.

Fortunately I'm well versed in driving fwd cars and those tricks I learned worked well with this tune.

Given that I know what this car is like, the only adjustment that would do this would be the super high front springs. All other settings wouldn't change it up that much. The springs were increased roughly 150lbs which is extreme. I would have just left them alone since they don't need to be dropped from starting values.
Rank: C-Class Racing License
#77 Posted : Monday, March 27, 2017 8:31:39 PM(UTC)
Assuming you are talking about my tune, impressive time Swerve! Are you sure you had the 271hp version ? lol

If it took you only 5 laps to kick out a mid 1.26 then adjustment period wasn't too long actually considering that the first two laps you have cold tires anyway. I know my Muscle car base tune takes things to extremes but it logically ends up in the way I tune cars with its soft chassis and suspension and heavy front weight bias. And IMHO stiff front springs and soft rear springs actually transfer weight to the rear if I'm not mistaken so they sort of counteract front weight bias.

Now the question is how does it compare to Baby Cows version in terms of handling and laptime. I still stand on my original guess that it's faster anywhere between 0.5-1 sec on medium sized tracks like Yas North.

Edited by user Tuesday, March 28, 2017 4:42:30 AM(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

Rank: On the Podium
#78 Posted : Tuesday, March 28, 2017 5:09:48 AM(UTC)
Yea it doesnt take me too long to figure out a car that has normal shifting. The times dropped rapidly from lap 3 to 5. Would take probably 20 laps to really fine tune my line usage and get muscle memory down. A few brake points weren't ideal and I had to lift off gas on two corner exits which was bad but didn't hurt the lap all that much.

To be honest, I'd use your tune minus the high front springs. I'd drop the car more too and then play around with other settings just to see what happens.

When I missed my line, let off the gas the weight would transfer but it was too much for the car and it would get really loose and unstable. Baby Cows tune was a lot looser generally speaking but you could throttle control your way thru the slide.

With no other upgrades, I'd use your tune with my changes to move the weight bias. This track tends to favor a more understeer prone car IMO.

This car is weird though. It is highly responsive with no tuning therefore as is I'd also add more understeer to it. With better upgrades that fixed the balance of the car, baby cows tune was neutral and felt really good. If I recall adjustment were needed to make it even looser.

To be honest I'm not sure what this proves outside of the importance of the build.
Rank: C-Class Racing License
#79 Posted : Tuesday, March 28, 2017 5:26:16 AM(UTC)
Originally Posted by: RPM Swerve Go to Quoted Post
Yea it doesnt take me too long to figure out a car that has normal shifting. The times dropped rapidly from lap 3 to 5. Would take probably 20 laps to really fine tune my line usage and get muscle memory down. A few brake points weren't ideal and I had to lift off gas on two corner exits which was bad but didn't hurt the lap all that much.

To be honest, I'd use your tune minus the high front springs. I'd drop the car more too and then play around with other settings just to see what happens.

When I missed my line, let off the gas the weight would transfer but it was too much for the car and it would get really loose and unstable. Baby Cows tune was a lot looser generally speaking but you could throttle control your way thru the slide.

With no other upgrades, I'd use your tune with my changes to move the weight bias. This track tends to favor a more understeer prone car IMO.

This car is weird though. It is highly responsive with no tuning therefore as is I'd also add more understeer to it. With better upgrades that fixed the balance of the car, baby cows tune was neutral and felt really good. If I recall adjustment were needed to make it even looser.

To be honest I'm not sure what this proves outside of the importance of the build.

So you used my tune but stock front springs for the 1.26.4 time?

I like to compare your changed settings.

Edited by user Tuesday, March 28, 2017 5:54:13 AM(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

Rank: On the Podium
#80 Posted : Tuesday, March 28, 2017 6:27:29 AM(UTC)
Originally Posted by: fifty inch Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: RPM Swerve Go to Quoted Post
Yea it doesnt take me too long to figure out a car that has normal shifting. The times dropped rapidly from lap 3 to 5. Would take probably 20 laps to really fine tune my line usage and get muscle memory down. A few brake points weren't ideal and I had to lift off gas on two corner exits which was bad but didn't hurt the lap all that much.

To be honest, I'd use your tune minus the high front springs. I'd drop the car more too and then play around with other settings just to see what happens.

When I missed my line, let off the gas the weight would transfer but it was too much for the car and it would get really loose and unstable. Baby Cows tune was a lot looser generally speaking but you could throttle control your way thru the slide.

With no other upgrades, I'd use your tune with my changes to move the weight bias. This track tends to favor a more understeer prone car IMO.

This car is weird though. It is highly responsive with no tuning therefore as is I'd also add more understeer to it. With better upgrades that fixed the balance of the car, baby cows tune was neutral and felt really good. If I recall adjustment were needed to make it even looser.

To be honest I'm not sure what this proves outside of the importance of the build.

So you used my tune but stock front springs for the 1.26.4 time?

I like to compare your changed settings.


My time was with 100% your tune. No changes made.
Rank: C-Class Racing License
#81 Posted : Tuesday, March 28, 2017 6:50:17 AM(UTC)
Can you post the changed settings you would use? I like to compare them with mine.

Edited by user Tuesday, March 28, 2017 6:51:02 AM(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

Rank: On the Podium
#82 Posted : Tuesday, March 28, 2017 9:25:12 AM(UTC)
Originally Posted by: fifty inch Go to Quoted Post
Can you post the changed settings you would use? I like to compare them with mine.


Idk the values but somewhere in the 450-500 range. Ride height would be slammed.
Rank: On the Podium
#83 Posted : Wednesday, March 29, 2017 6:40:38 AM(UTC)
Originally Posted by: RPM Swerve Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: fifty inch Go to Quoted Post
Can you post the changed settings you would use? I like to compare them with mine.


Idk the values but somewhere in the 450-500 range. Ride height would be slammed.


450 and slammed ride height worked in getting rid of the inertia I felt but the car became very loose. The really high front spring setting hid the loose feeling but didn't fix the problem. I think this is why if wrong line was taken the car would drift. Only did 2 laps and ran a 26.9. Didn't feel like running it more after realizing a lot of work was needed. Lol.

I didn't like how it took bumps so I'm thinking ride height would need to be raised in increments of 1.

Rear ARBs probably need to be decreased to 1 or 2 but idk if that would fix the problem with this car which is an over responsive rear end paired with lack of rear grip from tires.

I ran out of time so I didnt fool with ARBs or how car felt with rear tire width.

Basically a base tune with these upgrades isn't enough. The car needs extreme settings to really tap into its natural turn in ability.
Rank: C-Class Racing License
#84 Posted : Wednesday, March 29, 2017 7:57:55 AM(UTC)
Yeah I think if you lower front springs you need a completely overhauled tune (ARBs, dampers, diff maybe) that works in conjunction with lowered front springs. Basically a complete different tuning approach for muscle cars. Incremental changes will probably not work.

From my tests I really think the deciding factor for lap time is actually ride height. My settings allow a fairly high ride height that doesn't compromise handling in turns much but provides additional stability much similar to aero downforce. I tried it on Baby Cows version and it simply didn't work because it made the car too unstable in turns.

If you can come up with a version that has lower front springs and can produce similar or even faster lap times I would be very interested in.

And as a final note: all muscle cars in this game run on the same simulated car model. I know this because I can calculate a tune for any of the muscle cars that behaves exactly the same.

Edited by user Wednesday, March 29, 2017 8:05:26 AM(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

Rank: C-Class Racing License
#85 Posted : Wednesday, March 29, 2017 8:32:49 AM(UTC)
Fifty inch mind putting up the tune your talking about that works on the muscle cars. Thanks
Been racing since Forza 1...2005... NOT 2007 like it say's above.
Rank: C-Class Racing License
#86 Posted : Wednesday, March 29, 2017 8:44:14 AM(UTC)
It's not a simple fixed base tune.

It's more like a template that contains spring rate and ARB ratios depending on front/rear weight etc. that I use to calculate a tune for a specific car configuration.

So it's of no use if you don't have the calculator.
Rank: C-Class Racing License
#87 Posted : Tuesday, April 4, 2017 11:48:21 PM(UTC)
Found indeed a faster setup with lower ride height that got me a 1.26.4 on Yas North:

Rear aero: 106 (to match Baby Cows settings)
Ride height 7.0 (for me a tiny bit faster than lowest ride height 6.9)
Rear springs: 307.7
Everything else the same.

Either that or I improved my driving lol.

Edited by user Tuesday, April 4, 2017 11:49:15 PM(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

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