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Rank: A-Class Racing License
#1 Posted : Saturday, March 12, 2016 9:18:58 PM(UTC)
Hi all.

Having an issue with the 356A Speedster. As with most rear-engine cars, I've taken the steps to soften front springs/ARB's and tighten the back.

The Speedster seems to fish-tail around most corners. I've countered most of it with rear downforce but still can't tune it out to a satisfactory level.

Any thoughts? I've tried C, B and A class (A class is insane...don't bother with that class). Thought it was a power/throttle problem but seems that there's more issues.
I buy, upgrade and tune cars to the max. That's what I live for in Forza. I'm always in the need for more cars. Check out my custom routes in Horizon 4! https://forums.forzamoto...routes.aspx#post_1133141
Rank: S-Class Racing License
#2 Posted : Sunday, March 13, 2016 7:12:32 AM(UTC)
I have yet to drive that car but how much power does yours have?
Rank: C-Class Racing License
 1 user liked this post.
#3 Posted : Sunday, March 13, 2016 7:52:54 AM(UTC)
Will have a quick look when I get home if I'm not too tired, can you post your build??
Formerly SparcoRacing91

Owner of TopCenterRacing UK

Proud Support Sponsor of EKS World Rallycross
Rank: A-Class Racing License
#4 Posted : Sunday, March 13, 2016 5:56:03 PM(UTC)
Originally Posted by: Papa Hortis Go to Quoted Post
I have yet to drive that car but how much power does yours have?


Not much....175 HP. Car is only 1399 lbs but it's still not that bad. Currently running a B class build. It's not very fast in C class. I don't race D or E class (too slow for me. lol).

Originally Posted by: About500Rabbits Go to Quoted Post
Will have a quick look when I get home if I'm not too tired, can you post your build??


Sure! Thanks for offering.

Edit: I should mention, this is a corner exit/throttle issue.

Build as follows:

Forza front and back aero, rear bumper removed.

Race tires

Front/rear tire widths maxed (trying to build a small track car)

Cragar Boneville Series 391 rims, 17" rim size (I do this for stability....and to add style. ha ha)

Street Transmission, Race driveline, Race Diff

Race Brakes, Race springs/dampers, Race anti-roll bars (front/back), Race Weight reduction.

Sport Filter, Race Intake, Race Carburetor, Race Ignition, Race Exhaust, Street Cam, Race Valves, Race Block, Sport Pistons, Sport Oil

Open source tune (current, not the same as the shared one I have):

Tires: 27.5,27.5
No gear changes available
Chamber: 2.0,2.0 (don't usually set it this way but other settings made it worse)
Toe: 0,0
Front Caster: 5.0 (no affect from adjustment)
Anti-roll bars: 5.89,35.86 (adjusted to the extreme due to understeer despite high handling rating)
Springs: 315.4, 459.2 (rear) (again, understeer countering)
Ride Height: 6.7,6.7 (tried a rake (higher back than front) no affect).
Rebound: 7.0, 7.8 (not my usual settings for cars)
Bump: 2.0, 2.1
Downforce: 70, 200 (rear increased to max for grip)
Braking: 65%, 199 % (running abs so I just max it. Would re-tune for no ABS obviously)
Diff: 20%, 20% (increased diff settings for both front and rear had little to no affect whatsoever. (???))

Edited by user Sunday, March 13, 2016 6:00:13 PM(UTC)  | Reason: added reason for fish-tailing issue

I buy, upgrade and tune cars to the max. That's what I live for in Forza. I'm always in the need for more cars. Check out my custom routes in Horizon 4! https://forums.forzamoto...routes.aspx#post_1133141
Rank: S-Class Racing License
#5 Posted : Sunday, March 13, 2016 8:12:24 PM(UTC)
I didn't build it, but that diff setup seems way too low for me. I'd be looking more on the 60+ acc and 25-40 dec settings.
Actually the defult differential setup in FM6 seems to be favoring much more agressive diff setup than any previous FM game. and my RWD cars that used to run below 30acc diff setup always in FM4 and 5, now run on 60-80 acc diff setup.

Edited by user Sunday, March 13, 2016 8:13:18 PM(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

Proud member of Hard Luck Racing.

If your time isn't on HC board, it means nothing.

Mr. Oddball
Beat me with lotus, No big deal. Beat me with SUV, you have earned my respect
Rank: A-Class Racing License
#6 Posted : Sunday, March 13, 2016 10:03:39 PM(UTC)
Originally Posted by: HLR Juggernaut Go to Quoted Post
I didn't build it, but that diff setup seems way too low for me. I'd be looking more on the 60+ acc and 25-40 dec settings.
Actually the defult differential setup in FM6 seems to be favoring much more agressive diff setup than any previous FM game. and my RWD cars that used to run below 30acc diff setup always in FM4 and 5, now run on 60-80 acc diff setup.


Yup....that's just it....I would agree but I tried 75% acc with 20% dec with no affect. I've noticed that some DLC cars can't be tuned properly...or it seems that tuning has less of an affect.

I buy, upgrade and tune cars to the max. That's what I live for in Forza. I'm always in the need for more cars. Check out my custom routes in Horizon 4! https://forums.forzamoto...routes.aspx#post_1133141
Rank: B-Class Racing License
#7 Posted : Monday, March 14, 2016 2:07:48 AM(UTC)
Originally Posted by: HLR Juggernaut Go to Quoted Post
I didn't build it, but that diff setup seems way too low for me. I'd be looking more on the 60+ acc and 25-40 dec settings.
Actually the defult differential setup in FM6 seems to be favoring much more agressive diff setup than any previous FM game. and my RWD cars that used to run below 30acc diff setup always in FM4 and 5, now run on 60-80 acc diff setup.


My observation as well, default diff values (70/35) are a good starting point in FM6.

@Audible: try reversing the springs and dampers/rebound (rear softer than front) and dial up accel

Edited by user Monday, March 14, 2016 2:08:50 AM(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

Rank: C-Class Racing License
#8 Posted : Monday, March 14, 2016 7:44:29 AM(UTC)
Try 4.6/4.1 rebound and 5.7/6.4 compression and drop the rear 3 clicks below the front (6.7/6.4)

If that's an improvement then boost the acel lock to about 82, decel to 36, should help stability. If that improves it further double the front ARB and bring the rear down to 27.6ish
Should clear the skittish behaviour.

Let me know how you get on.
Formerly SparcoRacing91

Owner of TopCenterRacing UK

Proud Support Sponsor of EKS World Rallycross
Rank: S-Class Racing License
#9 Posted : Monday, March 14, 2016 12:00:27 PM(UTC)
its what your talking about is the lowers pi porche its upping the ride height on the rear and stiffening the suspension.
Rank: A-Class Racing License
#10 Posted : Monday, March 14, 2016 12:43:38 PM(UTC)
Originally Posted by: AudibleJam509 Go to Quoted Post
[quote=Papa Hortis;473066]
Tires: 27.5,27.5
No gear changes available
Chamber: 2.0,2.0 (don't usually set it this way but other settings made it worse)
Toe: 0,0
Front Caster: 5.0 (no affect from adjustment)
Anti-roll bars: 5.89,35.86 (adjusted to the extreme due to understeer despite high handling rating)
Springs: 315.4, 459.2 (rear) (again, understeer countering)
Ride Height: 6.7,6.7 (tried a rake (higher back than front) no affect).
Rebound: 7.0, 7.8 (not my usual settings for cars)
Bump: 2.0, 2.1
Downforce: 70, 200 (rear increased to max for grip)
Braking: 65%, 199 % (running abs so I just max it. Would re-tune for no ABS obviously)
Diff: 20%, 20% (increased diff settings for both front and rear had little to no affect whatsoever. (???))



Going by what I see, you have the car set up to oversteer (fish tail). The car itself you said weights around 1300ish pounds, so a car that light doesn't need the 450lb rear spring, try around 350 or less and play with it AFTER you lower the rear anti-roll bars as well, what you currently have looks like the old school FM2 AWD and FWD set-up (which still work great btw). If your having problems with power on oversteer, your one of generally two things.. your rear suspension is too stiff, or your diff accel setting is too high (higher HP cars). If you like your car feeling stiff or balanced, raise your rear rebound to near max so when you go around corners the lateral G load on the outside tire will grow gradually as the body of the car begins to rotate over through the corner. I don't have the Porsche DLC so I can't build and test for you. Lastly I would put a slight negative Toe (-0.2), to the front wheels to help with a little corner entry bite for your understeer. (Also just want to verify it'll be two RIGHT clicks for the Toe) I don't have the game in front of me to remember what side is each (+/-)
Rank: A-Class Racing License
#11 Posted : Monday, March 14, 2016 8:46:25 PM(UTC)
Originally Posted by: fifty inch Go to Quoted Post

My observation as well, default diff values (70/35) are a good starting point in FM6.

@Audible: try reversing the springs and dampers/rebound (rear softer than front) and dial up accel


Yup and yup...tried both. Dialing up acc diff makes this car drift even more and I'm barely touching the throttle. Reversing springs and dampers is how I started. MASSIVE understeer is the result. You guys should try the build. This car's default understeer...even with the high handling rating (5.9!)...makes it feel like a brick

Originally Posted by: About500Rabbits Go to Quoted Post
Try 4.6/4.1 rebound and 5.7/6.4 compression and drop the rear 3 clicks below the front (6.7/6.4)

If that's an improvement then boost the acel lock to about 82, decel to 36, should help stability. If that improves it further double the front ARB and bring the rear down to 27.6ish
Should clear the skittish behaviour.

Let me know how you get on.


Tried that....as above....makes the car worse. Rebound and compression changes do practically nothing for this car. I think tuning is just broken, for the most part, on this car.

Originally Posted by: MX Raptor Go to Quoted Post



Going by what I see, you have the car set up to oversteer (fish tail). The car itself you said weights around 1300ish pounds, so a car that light doesn't need the 450lb rear spring, try around 350 or less and play with it AFTER you lower the rear anti-roll bars as well, what you currently have looks like the old school FM2 AWD and FWD set-up (which still work great btw). If your having problems with power on oversteer, your one of generally two things.. your rear suspension is too stiff, or your diff accel setting is too high (higher HP cars). If you like your car feeling stiff or balanced, raise your rear rebound to near max so when you go around corners the lateral G load on the outside tire will grow gradually as the body of the car begins to rotate over through the corner. I don't have the Porsche DLC so I can't build and test for you. Lastly I would put a slight negative Toe (-0.2), to the front wheels to help with a little corner entry bite for your understeer. (Also just want to verify it'll be two RIGHT clicks for the Toe) I don't have the game in front of me to remember what side is each (+/-)


I totally agree! The problem is reversing/lowering the rear spring, with or without the rear anti-roll bar lowered, makes the car drift like mad in B class. I reversed the spring/anti-roll bar setting to counter the worse understeer.

In the end, I went with an extreme chamber: 3.5 front/3.0 rear and 0.2 degree rear toe (corner grip). This slightly improved the car but not much. This thing is just strange in this game.

I buy, upgrade and tune cars to the max. That's what I live for in Forza. I'm always in the need for more cars. Check out my custom routes in Horizon 4! https://forums.forzamoto...routes.aspx#post_1133141
Rank: S-Class Racing License
#12 Posted : Monday, March 14, 2016 10:01:12 PM(UTC)
Still havn't built the car as you did. I tried to push it up to B class when it came out. but I came in to conclusion that the car is bad in high classes, and I ended up in D class with it.

The main issues with this car are
-Wheelies
-Understeer
-Oversteer
the car is doing at least 2 of these in any case in higer classes. it's almost like Fiat 595 Abarth
In entry it never turns, on exit it possibly lift's the front up. and then the rear goes, or then the front won't lift and the rear just snaps loose.

I'd like to say that try lower classes.
Proud member of Hard Luck Racing.

If your time isn't on HC board, it means nothing.

Mr. Oddball
Beat me with lotus, No big deal. Beat me with SUV, you have earned my respect
Rank: C-Class Racing License
#13 Posted : Tuesday, March 15, 2016 6:44:01 AM(UTC)
I'm going to have a look at it when I get back from work. It's going to be another Ferarri 458 job by the sounds of it...
Formerly SparcoRacing91

Owner of TopCenterRacing UK

Proud Support Sponsor of EKS World Rallycross
Rank: S-Class Racing License
 1 user liked this post.
#14 Posted : Tuesday, March 15, 2016 8:05:10 AM(UTC)
Originally Posted by: About500Rabbits Go to Quoted Post
I'm going to have a look at it when I get back from work. It's going to be another Ferarri 458 job by the sounds of it...


Oh trust me, the 458 is a pleasure compared to this.595 abarth is pretty close how the porsche drives.
This pic is B class with street tires, GetPhoto8.ashx by MrPomomies, on Flickr
It turns in, pops a wheelie, and then the rear goes... Granted that the picture is taken before I got it as good as I was able to. but the handling didn't really change at all.
Proud member of Hard Luck Racing.

If your time isn't on HC board, it means nothing.

Mr. Oddball
Beat me with lotus, No big deal. Beat me with SUV, you have earned my respect
Rank: C-Class Racing License
#15 Posted : Tuesday, March 15, 2016 1:38:55 PM(UTC)
Boom 1 lap in to testing the gorgeous 356 and I've found the problem. Working to fix it, will update as soon as I've tuned this beastie.
Formerly SparcoRacing91

Owner of TopCenterRacing UK

Proud Support Sponsor of EKS World Rallycross
Rank: C-Class Racing License
#16 Posted : Tuesday, March 15, 2016 2:26:37 PM(UTC)
Ok then chaps, try this one on for size... Be aware, do not poke it with a stick because when it lets go it's gone. BUT it does have a much improved lateral grip rating over your the OP tune.

Search either my GT or RBBTS 356 in the description.

Feedback would be appreciated.
Formerly SparcoRacing91

Owner of TopCenterRacing UK

Proud Support Sponsor of EKS World Rallycross
Rank: S-Class Racing License
#17 Posted : Wednesday, March 16, 2016 8:22:16 PM(UTC)
I got one in a class shared, not hooked up but very driable.
Rank: S-Class Racing License
 1 user liked this post.
#18 Posted : Thursday, March 17, 2016 8:31:52 AM(UTC)
Good job rabbit, it's bit more drivable than what I got out of it. But it's still way too oversteery for my liking.

Overall, it's good for what it is, but overall it's rather horrible.
Proud member of Hard Luck Racing.

If your time isn't on HC board, it means nothing.

Mr. Oddball
Beat me with lotus, No big deal. Beat me with SUV, you have earned my respect
Rank: C-Class Racing License
#19 Posted : Thursday, March 17, 2016 8:42:12 AM(UTC)
Yeah I don't like it either. Nice to look at but would I race it??? Nope.
Formerly SparcoRacing91

Owner of TopCenterRacing UK

Proud Support Sponsor of EKS World Rallycross
Rank: A-Class Racing License
#20 Posted : Sunday, March 27, 2016 11:27:32 PM(UTC)
Heh, thanks guys, for trying this thing. It's good to know I'm not the only one who thinks this car is more for drifting than racing. lol
I buy, upgrade and tune cars to the max. That's what I live for in Forza. I'm always in the need for more cars. Check out my custom routes in Horizon 4! https://forums.forzamoto...routes.aspx#post_1133141
Rank: S-Class Racing License
#21 Posted : Sunday, March 27, 2016 11:51:21 PM(UTC)
Originally Posted by: AudibleJam509 Go to Quoted Post
Heh, thanks guys, for trying this thing. It's good to know I'm not the only one who thinks this car is more for drifting than racing. lol


It isn't all that bad, you just have to stick with E and D class with it
Proud member of Hard Luck Racing.

If your time isn't on HC board, it means nothing.

Mr. Oddball
Beat me with lotus, No big deal. Beat me with SUV, you have earned my respect
Rank: Driver's Permit
 1 user liked this post.
#22 Posted : Thursday, September 12, 2019 1:30:59 PM(UTC)
Voila fixed it
Omg it was hard had to transfer lots of weight on the rear to fix it in forza horizon 4
Ok the first use the forza tyres with drift suspension and equip front forza bumper plus the forza spoiler
Widen the rear tyres as much as you can
I own a speedster S2 class 979 with F6 4.0 liter engine it can beat most of the cars because it accelerates very fast and the top speed is 380km/h
Although I have to mention this fixes fishtailing in higher speeds more than 150km/h
But in some corners you should apply breaks a bit
Now to the tuning section
Tyres front 2.1 / rear 1.8
Alignment all to zero and front caster to 4.0
Antiroll bars front to 65.00 rear to 1.00
Springs all to the softest ride height front to lowest ans back to highest
Damping section front to 10.0 and rear to 3.0
Bump stiffness front to 5.0 and rear to 3.0
Aero front to 50.0 and rear to 140
Don't touch the breaks
Differential use AWD set all to 100% and the center balance 75% to rear
Took me two hours to get these please like if you liked the results

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