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Rank: X-Class Racing License
#26 Posted : Monday, May 27, 2019 11:00:41 PM(UTC)
Originally Posted by: Schumacher 9I Go to Quoted Post
Couple things I noted.

1. Smaller “incremental” penalties of .25 secs are step in right direction. Good work.
2. There still some issues with way system calculates an advantage. I have generally received fair penalties for advantages gained for clipping the inside kerb (cutting), however I also received similar penalties for running wide (extending) for no advantage. Example; I ran wide at Sonoma, the sweeper before final hairpin, I was all crossed up in a big “tankslapper” due putting wheels on the grass at high speed, lost a ton of time (approx. 3 secs) but also received a 2sec penalty. So that was a 5 sec error. Not sure how system calculates an advantage but the math seems off in scenarios like this.
3. Going offtrack to avoid an incident, results in a massive penalty because you passed several (crashing) cars, Something needs to be done about this. If the system can detect a incident "yellow flag" near the player can it temporarily remove the "gained a position" value from the equation until player is no longer near the incident.?
4. Track limits need to be reviewed with FRR. In particular alternate versions of VIR, Rio and Prague.
5. Disqualify "black flag" drivers that receive more than for example 25sec in a 4 lap race (maybe allow 10sec first lap and 5sec each following laps, depending on point 3).
6. It would be good to have FRR added to Leagues in future updates, to see the effect of penalties combined with the ranking system. These two systems together will be the key to good multiplayer racing in my opinion, as players with similar skills and sportsmanship will be grouped together.



Points 3 and 5 would be great. I've had similar issues in Forza and P.Cars 2 with penalties for going off track to avoid a collision. I'm not talking about me hitting a car because they're on the line and I'm going faster (or too fast) but a situation where two or more cars collide and you have to take evasive action.

Sure you gain positions in this scenario but you'd gain the positions anyways as the cars ahead have wrecked. Maybe join in on the wreck but know that, "you're penalty free."

You mention black flagging drivers who receive large amounts of penalties. I think this would be helpful and a step in the right direction. If the developers are able to Black flag for excessive penalty time however then they should also be obligated to Black flag for collisions. Whether intentionally or not, if a player causes several collisions in a race the should be penalized. In some cases the loss of time and position due to the collision is penalty enough but if they are wrecking on purpose they deserve a time penalty or dsq and ghosting. The were able to figure this out for Horizon 4 so they should be able to do it in this environment as well.
Rank: Forza Community Team
#27 Posted : Wednesday, May 29, 2019 2:38:40 PM(UTC)
Hi everyone,

Today we made a change to the ruleset of Forza Race Regulations (FRR). This change addresses issues around players accruing penalties at corner exit and when going off the track on a long straight. In addition, we have removed the penalty incurred for overtaking cars while off track. As this is a global FRR change, this will affect both the FRR public beta lobby as well as FRR-enabled private hoppers. As always we are curious to hear your feedback on this update; so please feel free to leave your comments in this thread. As a side note, wherever possible we encourage feedback that includes illustrative video examples of what players experience on track.

As we continue to experiment with rulesets we will keep the community informed in threads like these.

Thanks,
Brian

Brian Ekberg
Forza Community Manager
ForzaMotorsport.net
Rank: Driver's Permit
#28 Posted : Wednesday, May 29, 2019 3:44:18 PM(UTC)
I know the Forza Motorsport team wants to create something unique in the form of punishments in the Forza games, but I speak frankly that it is worthwhile to use punishment mechanics already known in other games like GT, F1, PC1 and 2. The improvements and refinements with the help of the community is very welcome too but do not forget to observe the other games that already apply well these mechanics of punishments.

PS: please give us new race track =)

Thank you for your work so far.

Edited by user Wednesday, May 29, 2019 3:45:13 PM(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

Rank: Racing Permit
#29 Posted : Wednesday, May 29, 2019 6:21:13 PM(UTC)
Originally Posted by: Mechberg Go to Quoted Post
Hi everyone,

Today we made a change to the ruleset of Forza Race Regulations (FRR). This change addresses issues around players accruing penalties at corner exit and when going off the track on a long straight. In addition, we have removed the penalty incurred for overtaking cars while off track. As this is a global FRR change, this will affect both the FRR public beta lobby as well as FRR-enabled private hoppers. As always we are curious to hear your feedback on this update; so please feel free to leave your comments in this thread. As a side note, wherever possible we encourage feedback that includes illustrative video examples of what players experience on track.

As we continue to experiment with rulesets we will keep the community informed in threads like these.

Thanks,
Brian


Thank you to Brian and the Turn 10 team for your efforts with FRR.

To clarify on earlier post, i fully expect to be penalized for extending track where i gained advantage (eg. on tarmac like Yas Marina, COTA, Watkins Glen), Where earlier post i was trying to describe running off onto grass and loosing time (no advantage).

i do agree that an advantage for extension needs be calculated differently than for cutting i.e More speed & more distance vs more speed & less distance. i'll will give the new update a go and report back, Thanks again.

Edited by user Wednesday, May 29, 2019 6:24:22 PM(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

Rank: S-Class Racing License
#30 Posted : Wednesday, May 29, 2019 7:23:21 PM(UTC)
So far in my limited experience with FRR, I think its a great step forward. On a race on Long Beach someone slammed me out of the way before the finish line and the penalties gave me the place back. If anything though, I think some of the penalties are not strong enough because the offending car can most of the time make up the difference by continuing onward after an incident.

-k
Rank: Racing Permit
#31 Posted : Wednesday, May 29, 2019 9:17:36 PM(UTC)
Honestly I’m really hoping the FRR comes to Free play soon. This would it make it so easy test the system without affecting anyone and I could continue testing even when not online.
(I have terrible internet offshore and I’d like to continue giving feedback).

Only thing I’ve really noticed this month was that penalties are very inconsistent on some corners. I literally cut the final chicane on Nurburgring GP and didn’t receive a penalty, yet I barely cut a corner on the Beach Circuit (one before the back straight) and get tagged with a 6 seconds. Yet another reason why I wish Free play had FRR testing is I could take the same car to each track to find which corners have problems.

As for the new update to FRR I’m absolutely ecstatic that you guys removed the extra penalty for passing. I was totally going to suggest that change after thinking about the “cutting to avoid accident” problem, hopefully in a week I can test it out.

Rank: Driver's Permit
#32 Posted : Thursday, May 30, 2019 3:21:51 AM(UTC)
I also strongly hope they can implement it in free play.

Not just for testing, but for fun. Not every player like racing online.

FRR in free play would be a very nice addition.


I frankly don't understand what is the reason for not mplementing it in free play. The only thing I can think of is some technical limitation.
Rank: Driver's License
#33 Posted : Thursday, May 30, 2019 9:41:00 PM(UTC)
Agree. I wanna know when they’ll fix the no penalty thing for when you go off track but hit the brakes knowing you won’t get a penalty. That and hitting people and no penalty which I know isn’t in yet but they’re my top two gripes.
Rank: Driver's Permit
#34 Posted : Thursday, May 30, 2019 11:41:01 PM(UTC)
Hey Forza Team

1. I raced with an old Porsche on the Nordschleife and in the begining there was a crash and some one polled me so , that i cut the track
(it was slower than if i would drive the track normal ) i got an 6 Secounds time Penalty for getting pushed out the track.

-At the end of the Long straight of the nordschleife someone crashed in me and pulled me in the bariers ( he used me as a brake ) he got no Penalty i got a 3 Secound Penalty.
- So i would like to see that guys ,wich are pushing someone out the track get an Penalty and the guy ,wich got pushed out the trck an time Bonus for that time he lost incase of that,
but when the guy pushes somone 3 or 4 times out the track or other guys he gets disqualified.

2. Also i got an time Penalty in Suzuka and Prag because i cut the chicane a bit. Maybe i was 0,050 or 1 secounds faster but i got an 5 secounds Penalty. At other tracs FRR works better but at those the Penaltys are very harsh. And when you see 24h of LMS very much cars are cuting the chicane a bit .
I would like if the track Limits are a bit more realistic an not so strict. I think you must have a Travel in the curves and chicanes. (:

Edited by user Saturday, June 1, 2019 5:16:48 AM(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

Rank: S-Class Racing License
#35 Posted : Friday, May 31, 2019 1:11:56 PM(UTC)
"...we removed the penalty incurred for overtaking cars while off track"

This is very worrying. There should be a penalty for overtaking people off track, however, it should co-exist in whether you gained an advantage in lap time in doing so, for example:

Cuts corner, gains lap time advantage, overtakes car in process = penalty

Pile up at T13, drives off track to avoid collision, doesn't gain lap time advantage, overtakes numerous cars = no penalty

This just seems like removing a feature of the penalty system that they couldn't refine.
Rank: X-Class Racing License
#36 Posted : Friday, May 31, 2019 2:51:11 PM(UTC)
Originally Posted by: EpicEvan777 Go to Quoted Post
"...we removed the penalty incurred for overtaking cars while off track"

This is very worrying. There should be a penalty for overtaking people off track, however, it should co-exist in whether you gained an advantage in lap time in doing so, for example:

Cuts corner, gains lap time advantage, overtakes car in process = penalty

Pile up at T13, drives off track to avoid collision, doesn't gain lap time advantage, overtakes numerous cars = no penalty

This just seems like removing a feature of the penalty system that they couldn't refine.


I feel the same way. Simply removing the penalty for passing cars off track means I can cut a corner take a minor penalty for cutting the corner and not be penalized for passing a handful of cars. This lack of penalty should apply when attempting to avoid an accident otherwise off track passes should be penalized with a time delay.

Some of the track limits needs to be looked at as well, for example that last chicane on Prague, when you come off the bridge leading to the second to last corner. There is so much pavement available there and it would be a prime passing opportunity if you're engaged in a battle but dude said the extremely limited track limits the track has been turned into a processional from the bridge to the last corner essentially.
Rank: Driver's Permit
#37 Posted : Friday, May 31, 2019 9:35:23 PM(UTC)
Is there any chance that we can get leaderboards for drifting and fix the drift line so it's not the race line bc plenty of the lines that you'd actually do drifting you don't run for points
Rank: Driver's Permit
#38 Posted : Sunday, June 2, 2019 3:01:31 AM(UTC)
FRR is great at the moment but would it be on Split Screen and free play modes? If so that would be great
Rank: A-Class Racing License
#39 Posted : Monday, June 3, 2019 5:24:03 AM(UTC)
It seems that ramming is much more of a problem in this hopper lobby. People feel that they ram you off the track and they get you a penalty, they can gain the place...not cool.
Also, maybe change the hopper? Not the same cars and tracks...maybe cycled division...or ABC'S?
And, not just in this lobby, but in others...when the car is already set IE, cycled production or spec racing...lower the intermission timing? And the lobbies where you get to choose a car, extend it about 15-30 seconds?

2013 HRPT long hauler in my 45th Anniversary SS!!!
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