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The OP WAS talking about transparency and communication between the team and we the players. This is a MAJOR issue and yet no official statement has been made, just the usual 'submit a ticket' response.

Guess what... check out all the posts all over the internet on the various sites about this. I guarantee that you don't have a staff big enough to handle all of the tickets that would be created if everyone affected did submit a ticket.

I, and I assume many others submitted a ticket as soon as I spotted the problem yesterday. Still nothing yet. No communication. No transparency. How about an official statement on all the various sites that people go to for answers about this game as to whether players that haven't updated yet should even start the game, much less do the update.

Sorry, 'submit a ticket' isn't cutting it this time. The current bug situation and how it even happened aside, I am so totally disappointed in the lack of communication and transparency being shown to your loyal players at this point.

Maybe you just want to hear from us in this thread that communication and transparency is totally lacking at this point, but the OP gave a concrete example of why we feel it is indeed totally lacking. AS a software developer, or indeed someone who is supplying a product to the public, I would not only want to know if the customers were happy or not, but more importantly, WHY they feel this way.

Edited by user Wednesday, May 8, 2019 6:54:10 AM(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

I was feeling better about the direction of the game after the previous month's livestream (not the most recent one, the one before), but now I'm quite concerned again if the testing/QA process allows this sort of bug to slip through undetected into the release channel.

Like was said in the above post, part of transparency is letting the community know ASAP when a major bug like this is discovered so they have the option to go offline and prevent the update from being installed to avoid losing perk points. Hopefully it will be resolved very soon, I'm hesitant to even start up the game (haven't run it since this botched update) and it just isn't a good situation between the weekly time gates that will punish me if I don't play by making me lose out on exclusive cars, or this bug that will punish me if I do by erasing many hours worth of skill points (and given that the devs STILL haven't resolved the lost Forzathon points due to the Lakeside Lodge ownership loss bug for VIP, I don't have much faith the devs will restore lost skill points in any sort of timely fashion, if ever).

This is apparently affecting everyone so I'm not starting the game or even turning on my 1X until it's fixed. Because of this I don't actually have the issue so I can't submit a ticket but its certainly affecting me since I can't play the game and will most likely miss out on the seasonal content because of it.

This should be discussed in a thread about transparency & communication because the developers aren't communicating with the players. They could tell us to hold off on the update until they can get it pulled or go ahead and install it, a fix is coming. I wouldn't want to be you today. You must be getting a lot of heat for something which isn't your fault but the company needs to get a statement out so people know what they should do.

In England they have probably gone home now.

They should stay home and stop messing up the game.

um, retro, this is a perfect example of a lack of communication regarding something rather URGENT. therefore, it's absolutely relevant to positive and pro active communication.

PG is not being transparent nor communicative given this example. thx

(ps: loved the stream yesterday. great Q&A :)

Edited by user Wednesday, May 8, 2019 10:56:41 AM(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

I agree with others that this is great example of lack of communication. PG is posted in twitter "oh hey look our new stream abaout update" but not nothing abaout this bug. Support page twitter do little better saying they know abaout this bug (but even there that is done perfectly because it's not telling that installing new update will wipeout skill points, would be nice if they would say that so people dont install update)

So if communication while major bug like this happend is something like "we know abaout this, if this affect to you submit ticket" and not nothing else i would say that is really really bad communication between devs and players.

It's not an example of lack of communication, more lack of common sense. RetroKrystal communicated that i'd posted something that wasn't what the thread was started for. So that's communication covered!
However she lacked any common sense by not at least pointing anyone in the right direction with a link (i'd assume as community liaison or whatever that she'd have a list by now).
She seems a little i don't know if this is the right word but "ditsy" seems apt. Like she's definitely concentrating some of the time! Maybe it's because she's young and new. Maybe it's because she is "ditsy". Who knows?
But at this point her reason behind this thread seems like it was moot point from the off! Almost as if she would only get to hear good things from a transparency thread!

@RetroKrystal This post is in no way attacking you, defaming you or otherwise besmirching your good name. I think that what you do is a hard job at times, and you are the one front and centre when it kicks off. The sacrificial lamb so to speak. We appreciate your work and just wish that sometimes you would stray that little bit further from PR approved responses when something as big a problem as this comes up! Because it's all over the internet now and still nothing much in the way of a response except a single tweet that states you're looking into it. On an account with only 6K followers. How many people are playing Horizon 4 again?

Following some of the above posts (and the questions about "I should have lists") hope this helps:

For live discussion - Join the Discord
For bug reports - As well as the discord (as it's live) the @Forza_Support twitter is useful. This is run by Turn10 NOT myself. (Clarifying as a few of you above think I cover that account). This account is where the "official statement/message" should come first and then is usually RT'ed by the other accounts (@forzamotorsport & @weareplayground)
For standard reports or information regarding Forza Horizon 4 - @weareplayground twitter. This IS run by myself over the approval of other PG members.
For any bugs/issues/crashes you have - Submit a ticket. This is run by the support team at Turn10
For any suggestions & feedback - Submit a ticket under the "Suggestions & Feedback" dropdown option. These tickets are personally answer by myself and I take note of every ticket & discuss them with the relevant teams.

Thanks for the posts, I'll try and get any further bugs/issues that happen across all forms of media quicker. I don't cover all forms so I appreciate your patience.

Edited by user Thursday, May 9, 2019 1:22:06 AM(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

So I just checked Discord, and can't see a single mention of this current (pretty game-breaking) bug, anywhere other than the Twitter feed channel for @forzasupport.

I don't think a pinned message on the #fh4-general, #fh-game-announcement and/or #service-and-status-updates channel(s) would be a ridiculous expectation?

Also, some information as to whether we're better off staying out of the game (as I have so far, and intend on doing until told otherwise), or whether the fix will restore the perks.

In general, there's been an extremely small amount of transparency *or* communication on this subject (see how I kept on topic, @RetroKrystal ? :) )

For a huge bug like this, no response is ridiculous. I can't load the game without breaking it so it's a game ending bug which is about as bad as you can get.

Here's the conversation I had with you on Discord regarding the matter if you couldn't find it. And it appears that you didn't want to help.
Also as noted, the support twitter is where the approved and official statement is given.
As I also mentioned, I will give an update when I can. At this current time, I don't have any further information to give. But once I do, it'll be posted on socials.

Edited by user Thursday, May 9, 2019 5:09:12 AM(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

That's the whole problem. 2 days into a major bug, that single tweet is a completely unacceptable level communication. Even if you have no more info, someone does, showing the total lack of transparency internally, let alone with the players.

You should probably check the timestamps before you attempt to publicly shame me.

I'd already checked Discord before making the forum post, and then successfully pinged you there and received more information on the issue that wasn't included in the original tweet.

It's hard to read Discord, but i think you said that it only effects certain cars, and certain players, but that is the wrong information, it effects everyone, and the game is completely broken. If you put the skills back on your car they disappear again... that means completely broken for everyone.

That's if your name is Submit A Ticket... which is a bit weird in itself.

Edited by user Thursday, May 9, 2019 6:28:00 AM(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

Also, thank you for following my suggestion and putting something in the game announcements channel in Discord, @RetroKrystal

Thanks @Retro for taking the time to respond to some discord spat which majority of people don't have visibility over.

Again, the repeated question is: Should we or should we not start the game post update?

Even an Unsure at this time will do.

You can start the game - But you will loose perks
If you don't start the game - That's okay but there's a potential of missing some Festival Playlist (because of the time restraints e.g dailies) as I do not have a date for the fix currently.

However once I do have more information or a date, I will update & give you that information as soon as possible.
I'm hoping to get more information by this time, tomorrow. (But I can not promise anything)

Hope that helps


That's a meme which was created by the community over several discords. It's also the same as the T-shirt I wore (which was sent to me by the communities too) in the Update 8 stream.

You do realise that the name Submit A Ticket means that you are announcing that Forza 4 is nearly always broken? Why would a company want to use the name Submit A ticket on a site called Discord which means to argue. So you are saying in full "You can argue with us about the faults in the game but just Submit a Ticket." Whereas a good company policy would be more like "We make sure that our games do not have faults in them!" The difference is miles apart.

It's not really fair for people to miss out on playlist rewards because they don't want to install a broken update. This season should be put on hold or the season shouldn't change until it's fixed.

I know you can't go off book and give a candid response but the devs need to give you more info to release. To keep within the topic of this thread, the players should be kept in the loop more than they are.

RED RIDER NL,

I'm with you on that, I happen to come from a Tech Support background, and one of the main drivers was quite simply KCI (Keep the Customer Informed). An informed customer is a relatively happy customer!

Since this has (again) only been posted to the @forzasupport Twitter account, I'll copy pasta it here as well:

"We have identified the issue with Car Mastery Skill Points in #ForzaHorizon4 and are working on getting a fix out on or before Monday the 13th of May. We recommend not spending any Skill Points at this time. More updates to come."

I'm assuming since there's no recommendation not to start the game up, everything is fine and we'll get all of our previous car masteries back after the weekend. That could have been made a lot clearer in the tweet (if it's even true), and relying on a single medium for communication could do with some improvement.

Hi CrazyDaveyBoy
,
Thanks for the update, you're quite right about the single medium thing, they need to bear in mind that not everybody uses Twitter / Facebook etc., I must admit that I am still wary of starting up the game until I know more, not sure how you feel about that? i.e is the fix coming out in a revamp of the update, or does one have download the update and then a fix?

I'm going to risk it, and then get *really* salty about it if I don't get my masteries back.

I'll be crying all over the many Regalia D's, MC12 FE's and Nismo LM's I'll be farming over the weekend, and wiping the tears away with all of the 300k credit bonuses I'll get from repeatedly putting skill points into a single 911 before restarting the game and doing it all over again, lol.

I don't cheat with games, and they cost money so you spend money to cheat on a game, that's not playing the game. Plus the selling price of all those cars will be worthless in the end, so the game gets ruined.

Edited by user Thursday, May 9, 2019 11:39:29 AM(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified