Is new Jag better than old Jag? (Please check out my improved tunes that are free in my storefront)

Got just about all of the old gang back together again. ; )

Yeah, drag tires wear really quickly. I would avoid using them whenever possible, because while they do allow you to increase your max lateral Gs without adding too much PI, they also screw up the handling of any car you put them on. Your brakes become very unresponsive, the car will understeer horribly on corner entry, and the car will slide wide mid turn without actually losing traction. You will have excellent traction on corner exit though. Some leaderboard car builds use drag tires to exploit the PI system and pull cars from higher classes down into lower classes (for example, a NASCAR Cup car in S-Class rather than R3), but these builds are always fairly tricky to drive.

I forgot to mention before, differential settings are different between AWD, RWD, and FWD cars.

When tuning a FWD car your accel setting controls how much torque steer you have (eg: 100 accel will give you the least torque steer), and the decel setting controls your lift off oversteer (eg: 100 decel should eliminate lift off oversteer). I typically ran 100 accel and between 30 to 50 decel, which would usually minimize torque steer and lift off oversteer while still allowing for decent turn in.

When tuning an AWD car you combine your FWD and RWD settings, but with a couple tweaks. For the front diff you wanna run as close to 100 accel as possible without making the car twitchy (eg: if the car is too snappy when turning, slowly reduce the accel number until the front is more stable. 95 is usually as low as I would have to go). The front decel I would almost always leave at 0, as any lift off oversteer issues are usually solved by adjusting the rear diff settings. Speaking of that… For the rear diff you want to use the same settings as you would a RWD car, so in my case 18 accel and 18 decel. And finally, you want to adjust your torque split so that the car rotates (turns) through a corner quickly, without the back end stepping out. This will vary by car, so start around 70% torque to the rear and work from there. If you’re getting FWD-like torque steer and the back end isn’t stepping out, put more power to the rear (eg: 75% torque split). If you’re getting RWD-like oversteer put more power to the front (eg: 65% torque split). Just to recap, my AWD diff settings would often look like this: (front) 100 accel/0 decel - (rear) 18 accel/18 decel - (torque split) 70%

Hopefully this will be of some use to you.

No props Tarry, I’ll give the 2009 cat a quick spin tonight and report back with time and my very unedumakated thinks etc.

2009 Jaguar time (Hockenheimring Full) beginning tune - 1:53:477

It’s peppy! I drive with TCS off so she lights up a fair bit from down low, sometimes using a gear higher helps control a bit of spin but at the expense off drive. Car tracks truly though with a hint of understeer on throttle closed through fast corners. With TCS on I was several seconds faster.

I’m more used to my elite controller now so a 360 controller looses a little feel for me which will slow me down a tinsy bit, plus lack of skill :-p

Another enjoyable car to drive, cheers! I’ll have another go a bit later and get a photo up, which I forgot this time… Got hungry :slight_smile:

TarryJagHok

Thanks gsxrboy750au and Yakov for your advice. Thanks for all of your guys advice. I’ll try to finish the improved tune for the 2009 Jag this weekend. Nice picture gsxrboy750au.

gsxrboy750au I am glad that you enjoyed the hybrid challenge. I will try to add a hybrid car or two to the next challenge idea.

Update new tunes for the Jaguars are in my storefront, please check them out. Thanks to Jdog there is a design you can put on the Jaguars to help you not get confused with which tune you have on the Jaguars.

2009 Jag design free in my storefront
JagCompPartDesign2Pic1 by TarryVariable1, on Flickr

2012 Jag design free in my storefront
2012JagPart2DesignPic1 by TarryVariable1, on Flickr

Thanks Tarry, I’ll give the new tune and paint a go this week :slight_smile:

Edit-

I struggled more in braking with this tune and the rear end spin moved up the rev range it feels like. Understeer was less for me as per previous comment. Lap time wise I was probably a tad faster with the new tune maybe. New paint looks trick!

I’ll have another go on the weekend if I can as I ran this with no sound so I might have missed feel due to that sense missing.

TarryJag2

Thanks gsxrboy750au for trying out new tune. With the braking I was trying to find a setting that was not too tight and not too loose. Hopefully with more practice you can get under 1:53. Hopefully Jdog is happy that people like his designs. Thanks Jdog for all the designs that you did for BigTime Muscle challenges. I hope some more people will try out the new tunes.

Yakov has a great understanding of tunes, I’m a beginner, but I know that when you chase one thing, you end up losing out somewhere else. More high speed stability, less low speed sharpness etc. Dog chasing its tail! That you ended up with similar times on track for me with coming at the problems from different angles shows your tuning ideas are on the right errrrr…track :slight_smile:

Or maybe I understand tuning as well as The Stig understands stairs, and I merely move sliders back and forth until a little voice in my head says “when.” ¯_(ツ)_/¯

Thanks gsxrboy750au. Hope more people will give me feedback on the new tunes.

A few days left for this comp. For those who participated, please let me know if you want credits.

Hey Tarry, I finally got-around-to trying the “improved” '09 Jag…

I think I got one clean lap out of the ten or so that I ran! …probably a state of mind that I’m in sort-of-thang, but it really, really, wants me to drive it at Wide-Open-Throttle!

– that is one aggressive kitty.

it feels too unyielding to be driven consistently; is a bit unnerving while at the same time fun to hammer on - if that makes any sense at all. I’m not knockin’ it – I’m tryin’ to say it’s not a hot-lap kind-of car and it’s also not really something I’d want to drive in traffic(!), but it does have a particular flavor that, if your in-the-mood, can scratch an itch ;^)

Thanks Leek sounds like you had fun trying out the new tune. I’m wondering more about if I changed the brakes to be less stiff and if the control of the improved tune was better or worse than the old tune. Or, was the changes I made too hard to tell the difference? Also, was the old tune easier or harder to get the hang of than the improved tune?

sorry, but I cannot say as both the build and the tune are different.

There were a few things that did not work on the first build (mostly the diff, if I recall correctly). Your new one is different build and it’s difficult to say what’s tune and what’s build to judge, really.

Thanks Leek. Seems like you are saying it is hard to tell the difference between the two tunes. Well I hope you had fun with both tunes. Hope all participants had fun with this comp. If anyone else would like to give me feedback about the tunes please post here. The more feedback I get the better I can learn at tuning.

it is difficult to tell you any subtle differences between the two tunes because the builds are different., very different.

Thanks for trying out both tunes gsxrboy750au and Leek. Here is link to my new comp. http://forums.forza.net/turn10_postst69786_Green-Cab-Racing.aspx