A Heartfelt Plea to Turn10 from an Avid Fan Since the Beginning

I am a true, Forza fan.

I am a gear head, racing junkie, car nut and complete whack-job when it comes to cars and going fast. When I can’t run my Camaro at one of my local racetracks against my cousin’s Mustang, I play Forza as I have since I got my very first XBox back in 2002. I was hooked from the beginning. My cousin and I are also consistently in the top 1% of the leaderboards and spend hours tuning each A Class car for each track.

… I know we’re pathetic and our wives remind us this all the time.

Over the last 15 years I have supported Forza Motorsports and Turn10 by purchasing the Ultimate Edition every time one comes out for every game including Horizon. I always talk about Forza with other “real” drivers, I show clips of some of my more interesting overtakes and boo boo’s. I’ve had a great run over the last decade and a half and I have great memories with some carpal tunnel to show for it.

I’m giving you this back-story in the hopes that someone from Turn10 will read it without quickly dismissing it.

Forza Motorsports 7 was like a swift shot to the nuts with a large, half-inch drive torque wrench.

Here’s why.

  • VIP mess-up. You guys know you messed up and already admitted it. Better late than never and thank you for taking action.
  • Loot crates… this has been talked about to death by gamers and the media. This level of evil is usually reserved for bad tippers and people who talk at the theater.
  • Homologation was a bad idea. Making Homologation a cornerstone when applying upgrades so that you can’t even see torque numbers anymore when applying engine parts??? Sure, it’s not like anyone trying to set up an engine for a car needs to be bothered by a pesky torque number anyway right? I understand what you were trying to do but you failed epically at it and because the homologation is so hopelessly woven into the game, I doubt you can do anything about it.
  • Still haven’t solved the “crasher problem” in lobbies. After 10 years of multiplayer, I’m convinced that you guys simply don’t care about this one anymore.
  • Glitches. The game on XBox One crashes every 4 or 5 races when playing online. After 3 or 4 races, the names of players no longer show up on the tags above the cars. The engine-revving audio glitch is BACK?? Wasn’t that fixed in Forza 5??? Car selection screen freezes and reloads.
  • Test Driving option is gone from Tuning and Upgrades. Find the person that removed that feature that has been there for the last 4 Forza games and have them repeat “Tuning and Test Driving go Hand-in-Hand!!!” 100 times in the parking lot.
  • Class leaderboards for each track removed??? Really?
  • Truck racing and side-by-sides are funny. I get it. Don’t let them in the hoppers please! I know you can do this, you did it before with that troublesome limousine in FM6.

The Forza Motorsports franchise has always been about cars, speed, competition and engineering beauty. Now I have to watch a random dude in a race suit do the pee-pee dance while I wait for races to load. Last time I saw a human being move like that, a spark plug wire and remote starter switch were involved.

Don’t get me wrong though, the game has a lot going for it. More cars, Suzuka, Mugello, Maple Valley coming back, dynamic weather effects are ground breaking and the flawless FM physics engine is still perfect. I also think it’s great that you guys are trying to make the game more “accessible” to a wider audience. More people being into cars and racing is a good thing. But this is not Horizon.

Just please, please, please do not forget about us loyal, hardcore, crazy gear head racing fans that love what you have done over the years. I’m still going to keep playing FM7 because I love what is good in it. I just implore you to stop taking away features that are good and putting in features just because they look good on a quarterly-earnings spreadsheet.



I agree 100% with everything said above, it seems allot of Horizon has unfortunately crept into FM7. Leaving out class leaderboards and multiplayer lobbies is a big mistake (This is my main reason I play Forza Motorsport, so literally Im just logging on and off to get the specialty dealer cars.) Hopefully the problem with missing features get rectified soon or I’m selling this game in the next few months.

I also noticed through multiple tests that the AI in this game are tuned to homologation as well. By this I mean they don’t respect PI at all any more. Cars with 30-40 points of PI between them still run as if they have the same PI. AI Cars don’t break away from each other and it’s sad to see the fastest car on the track come in last due to this new system.

It truly makes endurance racing boring when the fastest car on track with 40-50 points more than the entire field can’t make its way through the field and challenge the player anymore. (Did Spa 100 showcase and the lowest PI car on track finished 2nd) This feels like Horizon to me.


The irony is that even Horizon 3 has class based rivals which is nowhere to be found in FM7.


Did you really get carpal tunnel from Forza?

he probably did… but for a Real Car Track Day/Racer … but it’s not from playing with a wheel… Scott why are you using a Gamepad???

BTW… I’ve had the surgery on both hands, but it was mostly from racing motocross (since I was 14) and Track Bikes… it works good and is about 99% successful. But it will stop the gamepad playing for a month or so…!

I agree with you on everything, oh and I am still laughing from pee pee dance, oh my goodness that is funny.


I feel turn 10 has damaged their brand with everything you mentioned, but I will add to the critique. I feel the dynamic weather is incredibly limited and all tracks should be dynamic and have day and night cycle. Not having that to me was the biggest letdown, along with loot boxes and other gripes about animation. Turn 10 has shifted gears for the worst. I mean LOOTBOX’s, huge mistake for a racing sim.


Well, you (OP) bring up some good points, and agree the game as a whole is a bit of a step back from 6, but give it some time. Obviously they have some serious work cut out for them to deal with all the bugs and MP problems, people will feel a lot better about it once this stuff is resolved. But see my post in the other recent thread about this, there is a lot to like here too. I actually like the new single player campaign style. The homoglated stuff, not so much but it hasn’t destroyed SP for me yet. Also, spend some more time playing with the Free Play mode. Free Play and Test Drive in the last game were getting so similar I’m not suprised they merged them. Which is what they did, select “Custom” for Game Type in free play and you essentially have the Test Drive mode from before. You can manually turn on ghosts and such in the Advanced game setup menu. And speaking of menus and Free Play, the new level loading and options menu system is AMAZING. Being able to kick off a level load then play with your car selection, gear, tune, race options, etc while the next level loads in is the single best reason to get 7 IMO. This new system is so much win!

And yeah I hate that there are loot boxes, but at least they are all bought with game credits (which really seems to defeat the purpose of them). I don’t know why they even bothered but they are easy to ignore, like the stupid Mod card system from 6. Which I completely ignored in that game, but at least now all the mod cards do is give you more XP and credits if you achieve certain goals, which is fine.

Disagree completely. I like the new weather system but I seriously don’t want it to be able to engage anytime, on every track. In real life, it is always desirable to race in ideal conditions. While wet weather racing offers a little variety and a different set of skills to master, its generally avoided in real life and I definitely don’t want it forced on me when I don’t want it in the game. You should always be able to setup a game in ideal conditions at an ideal time of day. Only enduro racers have to deal with dawn\dusk
ight racing, those time of day options shouldn’t be forced on you either.

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great post
still hoping against hope someone from Turn10 appreciates that so many feel the same.


Not that I don’t want to bring up other games but if this GTS works, it could be something that Forza brings to the table. I am not talking about the FIA stuff but having a stat that calculates your clean racing and only pits you against other drivers with a similar score. This would weed out all the rammers out of MP and actually give people a genuine racing feeling instead of worrying who is going to ram you at corner one.


I agree. It’s so much worse for us PC gamers because we’ve been anxiously waiting for them to release a Forza Motorsports game on the PC and when they finally do it’s all messed up…


Forza Motorsport was not a launch title for the original Xbox. It did not come out until 2005. The game that did launch with the Xbox, only had one iteration, Sega GT 2002, as well as a separate online release.

But, once I played Forza Motorsport in 2005, I was hooked.

i loved Sega GT 2002 ! Omgosh that game was tops! haha brings back memories, i liked the licence tests, need more stuff like that in Forza, the SP is just a major grind as is

The prize crates aren’t “evil”. They probably wouldn’t have garnered media attention if they hadn’t been presented as crates. They’re pretty much the purchasable prize spins from Forza Horizon 3. The upcoming tokens may or may not be evil, but they’ve also been around since… what… Forza 4?

Homologation isn’t a bad idea. The implementation does leave a bit to be desired, though. Just ran into the torque issue recently when I finally decided something really needed tuned (the Cholla). And there should have been options for Class, and Class & Division alongside the Homologation rules.


I whole heartily agree with the OP.

As an guy who grew up in a sports car home, owned sports cars, went to performance driving schools and autocrossed on the weekend, I always came to Forza when my pockets could no longer support (quite often) my passion. Forza has alway been my only way to access my dreams. Taking a factory street car, picking the parts and tuning the car to win. Slowly the details are being removed and with it the components that make a gearhead like me grin from ear to ear.


BRAVO Scott! Very well said mate. I’m in the very same pool.

“Forza Motorsports 7 was like a swift shot to the nuts with a large, half-inch drive torque wrench.” <— LOL!!! I’m feeling the effects as we speak!

I’m surprised you didn’t pick the car sounds apart. This is indeed a bugged and rushed Forza. I hate to say this but I’m starting to lean more toward the Horizon games in terms of quality. But one thing I am not happy about is that they seem to be merging the two games - it’s one thing to incorporate elements from the FM games into Horizon (cos’ Lord that game could do with better realism) but elements from Horizon into FM? NO thanks, I’ll pass!

There’s definitely too much filler in the game just to jack up content - yes, I’m pointing a long accusatory finger at you loot crates, driver gear, homologation. Did I spell that right? I don’t care!!

Great post, I feel the same way. Looks like all the revenues might have gone to their head. MS and especially Forza used to be all about quality and putting the needs of “car guys” above everything else. The driving is brilliant as always, but bugs and shortcomings in the game is putting a big ugly blotch on an otherwise clean and freshly waxed paintjob, ya know?


Top post OP. 100% agree with every point you raised…
But I’ve gotta ask, your cousin wins those races right?
Stang is Built FORD Tough! =]

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As a fellow forza adict,I wholeheartedly agree,particularly on the homologation side of things.Oh god it’s just awful.Can’t we just race regular cars.
Good on you Scott,I thought I was the only one.


i agree with the OP 100% and would like to add to the critique for the PC version:

  1. we really need better replays, now even more with GTS coming out and just looking in the replays the way it does
  2. maybe also ramp up the HDR effects, again, i think GTS does a better job here although their tracks look more bland than forzas
  3. please fix the microstutter isues on PC (like it was solved in FH3 - but please not again 3/4 year after release)
  4. patch the LOD pop-ins on cars, its distracting
  5. add proper reflections to opponents cars and get rid of this strange matte lacque
  6. add rain and night option to all tracks (except rain on dubai or abu dhabi i get if thats unrealistic)
  7. add the possibility, like in GTS, to at least choose different static time of day for every track if the hardware of the one lacks the resources to give us completely dynamic.

Of all the new features added to FM7 the driver gear is the only one I find completely pointless. I mean who the h*** cares about driver gear in a motorsport game? It’s not like you’re going to look at the driver and admire the gear when you race…whoever came up with this driver gear idea must be a RPG fan (no offence to RPG fans) and decided that the game would be a lot more fun “if we allow the players to change their outfit”.