Forzamotorsport.net Forums

Big_o_xxx:

@ the Forum Mods, Che, and anyone else from T10 who reads this,

 I just wanted to add this to my ongoing rant:

I got my 360 back on thurs. and MS sent me a brand new console with HDMI output.
(I'm very pleased at this!)

I put in FM2 straight away and within 2 1/2 minutes of have the game on, it froze in my garage.
I played for the next 2 hours and it froze a total of 6 times.
I still cannot go into the design catalogs where I have a large # of designs without it freezing at all.

Please do not ever blame these faults with the game on the hardware ever again.

You technicallly answered your own question and issue here, you have a huge # of designs, your harddisk is prollt fragmented, seriously, if possible copy the designs to a Memory card, and delete them from the HDD then copy them back,

It froze in your garage and your design book, that litterally means the issue is somewhere in one of your designs, either the file is corrupted or what not, go thru your forza 2 save folder using the memory blade on your dashboard, betcha some are corrupted and have a yeller icon, which has nothing to do with FM2's software,

Big_o_xxx:

You mods have proven yourselves to be absolutely useless and I think I speak for the majority of sufferers here that we are sick of your lame excuses and it's way past time you get one of the developers in here and start sorting things out.

We are forum Mods, not tech support agents, however, we do offer advice and trouble shooting tips that have been proven to work, unless one of the mods said insert a cinnamin raisin bagel into your dvd drive, then that would be a different story.

and if you check the looooooooooooooooooooooong, but respect ful thread on xbox.com regarding xbox 360's and red lights, alot of the "new" HDMI enabled units still have ALOT of issues with games. let alone booting up, my brother just bought a brand new 360 Premium, w/ HDMI and 65nm, as evident by lot number, and its already going to to Repair, and all he did was boot to the dash and import his account from live, boom, 1 red light, so tell me that the hardware isnt a possibility, given the 360's history up to now.

So, could there be a issue with the paint catalog? sure, am I one to answer that question for Turn10?, No.

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Skate Zilla
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I Dont Work for Turn10, I just party in their playground!

Skate Zilla:

and if you check the looooooooooooooooooooooong, but respect ful thread on xbox.com regarding xbox 360's and red lights, alot of the "new" HDMI enabled units still have ALOT of issues with games. let alone booting up, my brother just bought a brand new 360 Premium, w/ HDMI and 65nm, as evident by lot number, and its already going to to Repair, and all he did was boot to the dash and import his account from live, boom, 1 red light, so tell me that the hardware isnt a possibility, given the 360's history up to now.

Ugh. That's really disappointing to read.

My first 360 went belly up after just a few weeks so I was waiting for the 65 nm chips to buy another.

I thought the new chip was supposed to be the big fix along with some other internal gut changes. I just can't buy a toaster that doesn't make toast. The only money I have tied up right now is in a disc and a wheel & I guess I could sell those if need be.

Sounds like I need to wait & spend my money when GT5 hits the shelves (if that ever happens). It sucks that things played out this way.

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A small but vocal customer...

cabbghd2:

Skate Zilla:

and if you check the looooooooooooooooooooooong, but respect ful thread on xbox.com regarding xbox 360's and red lights, alot of the "new" HDMI enabled units still have ALOT of issues with games. let alone booting up, my brother just bought a brand new 360 Premium, w/ HDMI and 65nm, as evident by lot number, and its already going to to Repair, and all he did was boot to the dash and import his account from live, boom, 1 red light, so tell me that the hardware isnt a possibility, given the 360's history up to now.

Ugh. That's really disappointing to read.

My first 360 went belly up after just a few weeks so I was waiting for the 65 nm chips to buy another.

I thought the new chip was supposed to be the big fix along with some other internal gut changes. I just can't buy a toaster that doesn't make toast. The only money I have tied up right now is in a disc and a wheel & I guess I could sell those if need be.

Sounds like I need to wait & spend my money when GT5 hits the shelves (if that ever happens). It sucks that things played out this way.

+1 but i don't mind waiting on GT5, the longer it takes the less problems the game will have most likely. And MGS4 is gonna rock 

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Speed Tuning painter and seller
<>

zero69r:

+1 but i don't mind waiting on GT5, the longer it takes the less problems the game will have most likely. And MGS4 is gonna rock 

Very true. I'd rather wait an extra year and have it be rock solid than have it rushed and be a mess.

I hope Polyphony gets the clutch functionality issue sorted out as well. Maybe it's just not working since it's a demo.

I guess I can trade the FM2 disc in on some old OXBOX games in the meantime. It's been working flawlessly since 2003.

 

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A small but vocal customer...

zero69r:

cabbghd2:

Skate Zilla:

and if you check the looooooooooooooooooooooong, but respect ful thread on xbox.com regarding xbox 360's and red lights, alot of the "new" HDMI enabled units still have ALOT of issues with games. let alone booting up, my brother just bought a brand new 360 Premium, w/ HDMI and 65nm, as evident by lot number, and its already going to to Repair, and all he did was boot to the dash and import his account from live, boom, 1 red light, so tell me that the hardware isnt a possibility, given the 360's history up to now.

Ugh. That's really disappointing to read.

My first 360 went belly up after just a few weeks so I was waiting for the 65 nm chips to buy another.

I thought the new chip was supposed to be the big fix along with some other internal gut changes. I just can't buy a toaster that doesn't make toast. The only money I have tied up right now is in a disc and a wheel & I guess I could sell those if need be.

Sounds like I need to wait & spend my money when GT5 hits the shelves (if that ever happens). It sucks that things played out this way.

+1 but i don't mind waiting on GT5, the longer it takes the less problems the game will have most likely. And MGS4 is gonna rock 

I have a PS3, and a Beta Testing Account with Sony, Maybe i should request a GT5 spot, Just to see how well it stacks up to forza.

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Skate Zilla
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I Dont Work for Turn10, I just party in their playground!

Skate Zilla:

I have a PS3, and a Beta Testing Account with Sony, Maybe i should request a GT5 spot, Just to see how well it stacks up to forza.

Hey, good idea. Please do. I'd love to hear some unbiased opinions from a trustworthy source.

I'll keep my fingers crossed hoping GT5 turns out to be something special.

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A small but vocal customer...

My freezing issues have been getting significantly worse as I added more custom painted liveries to my garage. My 360 would consistantly freeze whenever scrolling through the garage from either direction.

I had a launch 360 and recently upgraded the HD to 120GB which made no diiference - then I bought a new Halo 3 360 and just swapped my120GB drive to use my profile and all content / saves on the new system. The garage still froze consistantly

Then last night - I created a new XBOX Live account on my old XBOX and gifted more than half of my garage to that ID. All the cars came over fine and guess what - both garages can  now be scrolled quickly in either direction with no freeze!

So it definitely appears to be a fragmentation issue with the garage and many custom liveries. Not sure how I could have resolved this with a single XBOX, as I tried the suggestions previously of saving off custom designs and clearing out most of my cars.....


I have the GT5 Prologue demo running on my PS3 with a G25 wheel and playseat evo setup. I can tell you that for every multiplatform racing game that is good  - I will be buying the PS3 version over the Xbox 360 for the G25 support alone!

The Graphics and cockpit view of GT5 are amazing, but I still prefer Forza2 for the tuning, painting, and community aspects. Howver, I did pre-order GT5 Prologue for Dec 13 from NCS - as I can't wait to try out 16 player on-line races on Fuji speedway and the other tracks in 1080P HD. :D

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My Gallery | Team Website | Catalog | Free Tanktunes

Raudi:

My freezing issues have been getting significantly worse as I added more custom painted liveries to my garage. My 360 would consistantly freeze whenever scrolling through the garage from either direction.

I had a launch 360 and recently upgraded the HD to 120GB which made no diiference - then I bought a new Halo 3 360 and just swapped my120GB drive to use my profile and all content / saves on the new system. The garage still froze consistantly

Then last night - I created a new XBOX Live account on my old XBOX and gifted more than half of my garage to that ID. All the cars came over fine and guess what - both garages can  now be scrolled quickly in either direction with no freeze!

So it definitely appears to be a fragmentation issue with the garage and many custom liveries. Not sure how I could have resolved this with a single XBOX, as I tried the suggestions previously of saving off custom designs and clearing out most of my cars.....


I have the GT5 Prologue demo running on my PS3 with a G25 wheel and playseat evo setup. I can tell you that for every multiplatform racing game that is good  - I will be buying the PS3 version over the Xbox 360 for the G25 support alone!

The Graphics and cockpit view of GT5 are amazing, but I still prefer Forza2 for the tuning, painting, and community aspects. Howver, I did pre-order GT5 Prologue for Dec 13 from NCS - as I can't wait to try out 16 player on-line races on Fuji speedway and the other tracks in 1080P HD. :D

I think another issue people doent realize, is shadow copies,

in FM2, when you save a design, and go race, then go back and edit the design, then save it again, everytime you save it, the game makes another copy of the design, my integra design in all my videos, when I finished it, and went to copy it to other integras, there was 23 saved designs in the catalog, so, some people really should go through and delete any extra designs that arent applied to a car (usually they have a "house/garage" symbol on them if they are currently on a car.

so not only would you have all your custom designs, but all teh redundant stages from start to finish.

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Skate Zilla
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I Dont Work for Turn10, I just party in their playground!

Yah thats SOO true. Also guys why not just press X when you are searching for your cars in your garage. Search out the car you want in that menu instead. My game NEVER freezes when I do this.
Also if the select few of you want to go after the MODS like skatezilla. Just know that 95%++ of the people on here Totally respects their opinions and these forums would never be as clean and awesome without them. So before you go ranting about the MODS. Just think how crap would go undeleted and how messed up this could get.

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Remember- Drive it, like you stole it.

nachthai:

I can tell you something - I love the game and am tolerating the freezes (TVR's really seem to do it often) but hell will definately freeze over before I buy a new console to get a game to play decently. Before that happens I will change systems and put the 360 to rest along with the other consoles I own. I have over 32 consoles (3DO, PS1, Gamecube,Dreamcast ect) and I have never experienced this. I love the game and I have been happy with my 360 till now but this is really getting ridiculous.

Interesting about the TVR's, mine certainly has been unplayable from the crashes recently but every race i tried was a TVR Factory spec one.. i'll try some other races later and see how i get on

mine just froze randomely when i was like entering or exiting career mode or something... 

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Gamertag: AMG Sneaky Pete

Please don't drink and drive
RIP Casey (aka Pale Rider)

After re-reading through this thread, and a few more like it that have been hidden away in the more obscure discussion boards. It becomes painfully apparent that there is a real shell game going on here. You’ll read an actual, and sincere gripe from somebody that’s really upset that big business has reached into their pocket and flat out ripped them off without the slightest bit of remorse. Then here come the Mod’s and their clever little damage control posse. Sweet talking each other to death, as they down play and double dance step the real issues away.

Damn! We are still American’s right? Land of the free, home of the brave? We are still willing to defend our liberty (lib-er-ty 1. the freedom to think or act without being constrained by necessity or force) against all aggressors, foreign AND domestic?

The facts are- Yes, there are more people without freezing problems, than people with freezing problems. But the real question should be why? Now it’s very easy for the gaming industry to pass the buck back and forth. Like say Microsoft uses many different component contractors for 360 hardware. Or we as the consumer don’t take proper care of our 360’s. Or the discs are pressed at different facilities, or blah, blah, blah. But what does that really mean- nothing. Because it’s THEIR job to run quality control on their products, AND if the 360 is such a POS that it breaks if we bump it with a bagel, then again it’s THEIR job to make it better. It’s a good faith thing.

But it still doesn’t answer the question of why. Because we’re talking about code here right? Little lines of on-off code that tell their tale in pretty exacting terms, on a system that is pretty much standardized. It is a system in fact has to be standardized so game developers have a stable working platform, right? So how does a game degrade on its own? How does fixed code unravel? When no other games are degrading at all on that system? Getting, keeping, and collecting too many cool cars in our garage? Nope, deleted all mine. But the crash pattern remains exactly the same. Tried mutable disks, from mutable sources. To no avail. Because the crash pattern still remains exactly the same. As long as I maintain a baseline of user input, the resulting freeze effect remains constant. I even, as mentioned in an earlier post, tried it on multiple consoles, and each time saw a definite progression and pattern of activity as to how the game froze. So how does code do this? How does fixed code maintain a quantifiable progression of degradation, even when you change mutable effectuating components, but maintain a baseline input?

Seems a bit of a conundrum.

So let’s ask again the question of why? Why do a percentage of the users have such sweeping, seemingly redundant failures that are not even being addressed by the people who designed it line, by line, by line of code. What could possibly be the motive behind just leaving people who are huge fans of your game out in the cold, without even a word? What Does Turn 10, and Microsoft have to gain by such an action? Do you think they’re just hiding, hoping it will all simply blow away because they’re just too penny pinching to give a damn? Or maybe they’re just to incompetent to figure it out, and don’t have the balls to admit it? Or, is this in fact exactly what they want? That the freezes are in fact- a code thing. A written code thing.

But the answer to the question of why is one you have to be willing to search out on your own, or it really won’t have any meaning at all. We either take control, or we give it up. There’s no middle ground. Our Founding Fathers used to say- Give me liberty, or give me death, and they meant it. So the real question is, what’s your liberty worth to you? Just what controls are you willing to except in your world?

Or better yet, forget all that, the game’s just on the fritz. Yeah, that makes more sense. Nobodies got the least bit of control, because it’s all just on the fritz. That damn fritz, who can pin it down. It just fritzes.

What else can I say.

Except…

Microsoft, make it right. What good is all that money if it costs not only you, but the rest of us as well a portion of our humanity? If it costs this nation it’s integrity? Let the damn divide and conquer, power and control politics of sales at any cost or price go. Just make a solid product, and it will sell itself. Pride of craft has been replaced by profit of craft, and it wasn’t by any standard a good trade. Don’t you see you are one of our leaders. That you set a pace and tone that reaches a huge portion of not only this country’s population, but the worlds. Little things like this matter, because they’re systematic and effectual of much bigger ones. Bigger ones that will without doubt come back one day to bite us all in the ass. Whether you have a big house in Olympus with a guarded gate, or not.

Turn 10, damn guys, you made a landmark game here. An actual work of art. When it works it is one of the best video games ever created. Truly. A game which should be bringing a little respite, a little time out to people who are burdened by the relentless demands, and time crushing expectations of a modern world. But instead you just leave them hanging in anger and disillusionment as you happily take their money to the bank.

So, is that it? Is that all we have left? Dog eat dog, suckers get no bone?

Unless of course you’re getting paid to be on the inside looking out. Then it’s YaHoo, I’m not the sucker, you are. Na na nana na.

If only our Founding Fathers, and all the brave patriots that willingly laid down their lives on the field of battle to give birth to this nation, this United States of America could see us now.

Project BlackJack-SideFX:

1- Delete un-used Cars
If you have a very large car collection it is possible to reduce the probability of this problem occurring by limiting the number of cars in your garage.

What a pile of crap.  There's an achievement for owning every car in the game.  If you also get the DLC cars, you're pretty close to hitting the software-enforced garage car limit of the game, which is already too low IMHO.  (I want to be able to buy every car STOCK and MODIFIED to each class it can be modded too).  Now you're telling us to reduce our cars even further?  What BS.

Why ship a game with so many cars, and so many upgrades for them, if we can't use them all simultaneously.  Total BS.

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http://www.trackpedia.com

2006 S60R 6M, Sonic Blue

hahah you have NO IDEA what your talking about. You can have 100 cars with tunes and parts all over them. Its when you put these MASSIVE paints jobs with 700 layers each on them. thats ALLOT of data to crunch.

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Remember- Drive it, like you stole it.

ToolerThanTool:

After re-reading through this thread, and a few more like it that have been hidden away in the more obscure discussion boards. It becomes painfully apparent that there is a real shell game going on here. You’ll read an actual, and sincere gripe from somebody that’s really upset that big business has reached into their pocket and flat out ripped them off without the slightest bit of remorse. Then here come the Mod’s and their clever little damage control posse. Sweet talking each other to death, as they down play and double dance step the real issues away. Damn! .

+1 Tooler.
You put these issue in a better perspective than I ever could have.
And I'm also glad you were one to notice the song and dance that's been going on in here.
It's obvious this is spin control, especially when you read a post that sticks up for Skatezilla, who constantly contradicts himself.

It's not just that I'm experiencing the freezing issues.
I've suffered every single issue this game has: Corrupted and lost profile, vinyls shifting around aimlessly, random auction house banning, etc...

MY Girl just bought the hloiday bundle with Forza and she has none of my designs but ones she did purchase off of the AH and now that she's received them, she has freezing issues too.
What message does that send to a brand new player??

The only advice we've been given is to strip our garage and delete our designs.
What good is that?

And then more and moe spin blaming the console and it's multitude of defects.
I seriously wonder why I bought the thing at all any more, and as much as I dislike Sony products, the temprtation becomes greater to purchase one as my 360 experience grows weaker.

No one mentions M$'s tendency to rush thngs tot he marketplace early, while still containing many bugs.
This has been evident with their operating systems forever, now it's thier gaming consoles.
Isn't Turn 10 a M$ owned studio??
Why are they exempt from the typical M$ machinations?
We all know FM2 was rushed.
Why is it so hard to fathom that it doesn't have bugs?
(It has plenty of bugs for sure, but in true M$ fashion all we ae met with is denial as soon as we try to bring these situations to light.)

I'm simply tired of being told to downgrade my game and that the xbox 360 is a total POS.
Why can't we get an offical developer in here to consult with us instead of a forum lacky running spin control.

Che, the community manager told us to email him in regards to our porblems in another thread but after 3 attempts, I only got a 2 sentence response basically telling me to delete my saved game and start over.  After I replied back, I never heard from him again.

Zilla talks in circles.
One minute he plays the role of the expert and tries to convince us it's all the hardware's fault, next minute he says he's not a develpoer and has no idea what the problem is.  Frist our harware is faulty, then it's too many designs in our garage, next our harddrive is fragmented, and it goes on and on.
(BTW, if my hd is fragged, FM2 is responsible as no other game writes and pulls from the hard drive as frequently as this game does.)
Shadow copies??  On my machine, if I don't save a design directly to the catalog it doesn't show up in there.
I delete all duplicate copies as new ones are saved as I don't want to confuse older desgins with the updated ones.
Plus, what use is that great liverey editor if we can only save 3 designs??
Why can't the mods acknowledge any of these faults?

It's oh-so-obvious that 'zilla is one of the ones on the inside looking out, with his close attachment to both sony and M$, his discounts on their products, and the incentives he receives to spin these issues in the company's favor.  (Along with his damage control posse.)


I'm with you tooler, I want to know WHY.
WHY did I lose my saved game?
WHY did my console die while playing FM2 when I never experienced any problems with anyother game?
WHY does the game freeze in the AH and on the Track as well as in the Garage?
WHY do we get randomly banned from the AH?
WHY is the AH currently glitching and  either ending auctions early or boucing them back up 5 or 10 minutes at a time?
(Hell, if M$ producduces such a quality product then WHY are they recalling the racing wheel and shipping out a new one?)

If it's not bad code, what the hell else could it be?
and most imprtantly, WHY, oh WHY does  Turn 10 keep ignoring us and leaving this to the mods??


Tooler, you got it spot-on with the "left hanging in anger and disillusionment"  remark.

It's obvious this isn't going to go anywhere.
I'm done.

Hey Big_o_xxx

Thanks for the kudos.

It’s indeed a sad state when all we have left to believe in is spin control. Your statements, and the passion in which they are conveyed, show just how much the moments we take from our daily lives to just push our ass back in the cushion, and burn some rubber is important to staying level in a which end is up world. Forza 2 is one of those rare doors you can walk through, and just leave all the rest of the crap behind.

BUT, then the crap just followed some of us right on in.

Like you, and every other fuel blooded race sim junkie, I dug the hell out of this game. I’d finished all the tracks, won all the trophy’s, broke my cherry at level fifty, and was in the process of putting my stable together so I could go online and push it all to the edge.

BUT, then the crap just followed some of us right on in.

Trouble is we forget who’s supplying us with our fix here. Because we’re too wrapped up in finding our groove, and then getting’ it on. We forget that Microsoft and Turn 10 are big business, and what does big business want- no, it’s not money. Big business wants control. Because with control comes power. The power to take whatever they want, how and when they want, knowing there’s not a damn thing little nobodies like you and me can do about it. Sad little world we’re building here.

Bottom line- Until it’s in their (Microsoft, and Turn 10) best interest to put an end to this whole crash and burn fiasco they’re running with here, if it ever is, nothing’s going to change. We’ll all just have to mossy on over to Sony land and fall in love with GT5 I guess, and hope she treats us a little better than this *** did.

Because if anybody thinks they’re going to get any real answers out of anybody on the inside looking out, go rent The Insider and watch how it all works out for Russell Crow.

The Man:

hahah you have NO IDEA what your talking about. You can have 100 cars with tunes and parts all over them. Its when you put these MASSIVE paints jobs with 700 layers each on them. thats ALLOT of data to crunch.

Haha right back at you and while you're at it, Get bent!
Do you mean to tell us this next-gen console with a multithread cpu and 512 megs of RAM can't handle 300 cars designs that are no more than 20k fully painted and layered??

FM1 was on a machine with a 700 mhz celeron CPU and only 64 meg of ram and I never had issues with the game crashing when the garage was full of painted cars.
Granted, you only got 200 layers or so but you also had little more than 1/10th the ram and 1/5th the cpu power.

This is exactly the kind of attitude that's turning us off and causing the numbers in the communtiy to decrease
We take these issues quite seriously and don't need fanboy geeks like yourself dishing out unwarranted ridicule.
This game freezes when you only have 3 cars without paint on them just like it does when you have the garage full of designs.
It freezes when you receive a car from the AH.
It freezes when you go online to enter a race.
It freezes in the middle of a race.

And as far as your wisdom goes:
Why bother puting a 300 car limit in the game when you can only have 5 in your garage??
Why give us a paint editor and 1000 layers per side when we cant use it?
Can you answer these questions?  NO

What makes you think YOU know what you're talking about either?
Why act elitist?
You think that kid needs you laughing in his face?

Karma, dude.
It'll come back on you.

BTW:
When I restarted my profile it froze on me with only 3 stock cars in the garage. (One bought at the initial start and 2 from winning cups.)

My girlfriend only has 12 cars total on a brand new xbox with a brand new disk and hers freezes now that she's been online too. (She only has a silver account and hasn't even experienced the AH. All cars were gifted to her from me and none were from my design catalog.)

You don't have a clue, MAN, and I suggest you shut up.

Way to support your fellow gamer, scumbag!
If you have nothing constructive to say, keep these comments to yourself.
(*I guess you guys figure by insulting us we'll get fed up and leave.)

All I want from Turn 10 now is an explanation to why FM2 has a MULTITUDE of issues and an offer for my money to be refunded for the return of this defective product.

haha I played a couple nights ago for 4 hours straight with NO snags or freezing issues.
Can you give me an answer to why it didnt freeze? NO
Can you honestly say the paint shop doesnt work. NO
Why act like a Jerk? Do you really need the bad rep?

You honestly need to GROW up and if you have some EVIDENCE or CLEAR CUT facts to say. Say it to me nicely without the CRAP (scumbag.....). If you prove me wrong, FINE, THATS COOL. I wont take it personally. You learn something new everyday.
But if you wanna come on here and insult me FOR NO reason and try to make me look like a fool. Shove it.

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Remember- Drive it, like you stole it.

I'd like to remind you that I never said there isnt any issues, I Personally had a lock up or two while painting,

I'm just saying NO company can fix all the bugs at the same time, others are easier to debug and fix that others, some bugs may be small but require a huge re-write if its something used by all aspects of the game.

Didnt it take Bungie like 2 years to Fix Halo 2's "Hacking"?

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Skate Zilla
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I Dont Work for Turn10, I just party in their playground!

Shoulda bought a mac hahah***

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Remember- Drive it, like you stole it.